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Discussion Starter #1
The latest issue of GUNS magazine has a very interesting shoot out or the major WWII sniper rifles , using original issue ammo and correct (original or repro) scopes. They shoot for group out to 600yds and shoot at a 4ft dia gong at 1000.

Springfield 1903
Remington '03A4
German Mauser
Brit Enfield No.4T
Mosin-Nagant 91/30

The results might surprise ya.
 

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I would hesitate to guess, as there are several legendary rifles there. I KNOW Mosin Ns shoot, and the 7.62R round is inherently accurate....So here's my picks:

1)Mosin
2)Mauser
3)RemyA4
4)Enfield
5)1903



And those are wild guesses....Way cool, now I have to buy a magazine....
 

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I was disappointed with the average accuracy of the 1903. I don't believe the testing was very scientific. More of a fun shoot just to get an article in the magazine.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I don't believe the testing was very scientific. More of a fun shoot just to get an article in the magazine.
Perhaps , but I think they did the shoot in the same manner as 90% of the casual shooter/collector would.

I also think they dispelled a lot of myths and BS that gets tossed around.
 

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I don't have a clue what their rifles will do. I have some good memories of what my 03A4 with some 180 grn. Sierra match bullets and IMR4350 can do.
 

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Just tryin' to do the best I can with what I've got.GI6

It didn't have the Weaver 330 on it either (does now, but I don't shoot it these days).

One of each is not much of a test. We all know that if there's 2 "just alike" on the rack one will outshot the other one the majority of the time.
 

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;)

A properly set up #4T should be on top of that pile.

 

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I would pick the 1903A4 and then the 1903. I know what my 1903A3 will do at 600 yards slinged up prone with as issued sights, I can only imagine how good it would do scoped and on sand bags!GI1
 

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Venturinos father in the article stated He didn't generally shoot over 200 yards as a sniper. He was in Holland which was September of '44 which would have seen alot of house to house fighting. Are there any good books on WW2 snipers out there? I would have thought the distances would have been 3 to 400 hundred yards anyway. It seems like a good rifleman with his Garand could've done the same thing.
 

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A scope helps you see things better. You might not be able to see that blob in the dark of a room that is an enemy soldier, or just inside the tree line, or a part of someone leaning up against a truck from an off angle view. The scope just helps a good rifleman see/identify the target and hit smaller targets than he might be able to see without the scope.
 

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Having shot all of those, I'd say:

1. 1903A4
2. No.4T
3. Mosin-Nagant
4. 1903
5. Mauser

I bet the 1903a4 and the Enfield sniper are pretty close... both have an excellent trigger and are set up relatively comfortably for scoped shooting (especially the enfield), but I gave the edge to the 1903 because in a 600 yard competition, the .30'06 would have an edge over the .303.

The Nagant and Mauser were both a little more awkward when scoped... their scopes set quite high and required an improvised cheek rest to be built up (if the shooter knew to do so). Neither had a really outstanding trigger. I find that I am capable of getting better groups out of surplus Mosins than I am out of K98s, for whatever reason, so I rated them that way.

However, I think the highest-scoring sniper of the war (Vasily Zaitsev IIRC) had a Mosin... but he was in a target rich environment that was a sniper's paradise (Stalingrad). That was definitely a case of the right man being in the right place at the right time. I think he would have cleaned up no matter what his tool was... I think he used captured German Mausers on occasion, too.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Well , top dog was the Mosin nagant. It shot 7in groups at 600yds , and was the only rifle that they could consistantly ring a 4ft dia steel gong at 1000yds with.

The Enfield was dead last.

Remember , they were using old ammo. Not modren match stuff.
 

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I guess I wasn't that far off.

As simple as the Mosin is, coupled with the 7.62R round and that nice long barrel it is a shooter. Cheesy, but a good shooter.

The real Legacy of the rifles mentioned is the Mauser, that continues to influence bolt gun design to this day.

I don't know how it ranked, but I'll have another 1903a3 one day. Thats my favorite.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
The Mauser was a close second on most points. It did have that goofy ZF-41 scope mounted half-way down the barrel , like Coopers Scout rifle concept. , the -03s , and there were a few variations , surprised me as being so lame. But while the Marines sometimes used national match grade 1903s with air-gaged barrels and bedded into their stocks , the general issue Remington 1903A4 was nothing special. The barrels were picked at random and there was no special attention paid to their assembly. There was no special sniper training either. Usually , the squads best marksman got the scoped rifle.
 

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I'll take an 03A3 any day.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
A few months ago , Guns & Ammo did an article on the Swedish 41B sniper rifle. They got MOA groups with it.
 

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Speaking of Swedish Mausers, I had 4 M96B's when I was about 20 years old, it was by far the most accurate surplus military rifle i have ever to this day fired- and i was using the old steel patrone swedish ammo. An honest 1 MOA rifle- only disadvantage was it was perminantly dialed in for 300 M.

Shoulda kept one and made it into a carbine.
 
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