SAI barrel accuracy
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Like comparing a VW to a Benz. Your talking about the difference between a mass produced button rifled barrel and a relatively small run on a single point cut rifle barrel. My SAI rifle came with a Krieger barrel on it. They come standard on the M21 and SM rifles although at some point they were installing Douglas barrels and switched to Krieger. They may even still offer the Douglas on the SM or NM. Have not been on there sight for years.
You have to also take into consideration that the rifles that come with the Krieger or Douglas barrels are accurized with NM mods and bedded, they are also heavy contour as opposed to standard contour. A SM or NM will hold the x ring off bags where a Standard or loaded will hold the 10 ring at 100 yards on an SR-1 target.
You have to also take into consideration that the rifles that come with the Krieger or Douglas barrels are accurized with NM mods and bedded, they are also heavy contour as opposed to standard contour. A SM or NM will hold the x ring off bags where a Standard or loaded will hold the 10 ring at 100 yards on an SR-1 target.
The '80's-'90's Wilson barrels were generally good. Last I heard, SAI is currently getting barrels from Mossberg, unless you want a Krieger or Douglas. Mossberg makes respectable barrels for its bolt-action rifles. Shooters with new(er) M1A's don't seem to be complaining about barrels. Sometimes other parts and sloppy assembly.
I just picked a stainless loaded at a price I could not turn down. I put a McMillan stock on it and did most of the match rifle procedures. She shot 1.5in 5 shot groups at 100yds. Is this the best I can expect with the SAI NM stainless barrel? Thanks Joe.
Iron sights or with a scope?
I don't know how much your stainless bbl has been shot or with what or how your rifle has been maintained. Inspect, clean & prep, grease it up, like you would a new one. If it all possible where you shoot, sling 'er up and fire some good ammo from prone at 100 or 200 with the iron sights. It'll give you a better look/feel for your rifle's practical grouping tendencies. You want round, in a wad more or less. May not have been shot much. That Hakko scope, put it on one of your bolt-action rifles and bench it through a 4-corner test. Some of them weren't very good and SAI ended up discontinuing the product.
I own a NM m1a that is only a couple of years old with stainless NM barrel. It shoots great with 155 grain bullets (Like half inch 5 shot groups at 100 yards sometimes. from a sandbag with iron sights) But groups about what you are getting with the gold medal 168s and 175s. I have got handloads to shoot an inch with 168 grain bullets and H4895 powder. But try the 155s. Hornady AMAX is what im handloading for accuracy right now. Nothing wrong with upgrading your barrel if you plan to compete with it though, and if you have the spare cash.
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This is a great point. Until you try a full array of ammo/loads/bullet types, you probably can't definitively say that 1.5 MOA is the best the rifle can do. It may do 1 MOA in its current config, and you may never know it unless you put in the hours and dollars of running different loads through it.
An M1A gunsmith friend of mine turned me on to the 155s. He experienced the same problems you and I have run into. He got amazing results from 155 grain sierra palma matchking bullets and IMR 4895. I have had better luck with hornady AMAX. I was just short of changing the barrel myself. Like I posted earlier, the 168s can be made to shoot respectable too but it seems to love the 155s.
Is there any information on what brand bbls SAI used on the Jan-'03' std?
I had expected a GI CL bbl as that was what was advertised when I purchased(ordered)
the rifle around xmas of '02' but it came with a carbon steel bbl. After some teething problems that SAI was happy to address and throw in a USGI TG the accuracy is about what I expected from a battle rifle of this type and ball ammo.100M sandbagged 2.5-3.5 MOA 5 shot groups with surplus ball.The only accuracy enhancing has been to shim the loose GC/band ass.I believe if the front band/forend had proper tension groups would again shrink considerably.So I believe the bbl to be perfectly adequate for my particular needs and assuming the rifle were to be bedded w/adequate forend tension 1-1.5 MOA wouldnt suprise me at all which isnt bad even for a bolt gun with a light bbl-ball ammo.
I had expected a GI CL bbl as that was what was advertised when I purchased(ordered)
the rifle around xmas of '02' but it came with a carbon steel bbl. After some teething problems that SAI was happy to address and throw in a USGI TG the accuracy is about what I expected from a battle rifle of this type and ball ammo.100M sandbagged 2.5-3.5 MOA 5 shot groups with surplus ball.The only accuracy enhancing has been to shim the loose GC/band ass.I believe if the front band/forend had proper tension groups would again shrink considerably.So I believe the bbl to be perfectly adequate for my particular needs and assuming the rifle were to be bedded w/adequate forend tension 1-1.5 MOA wouldnt suprise me at all which isnt bad even for a bolt gun with a light bbl-ball ammo.
Just got back from the range. My first cold,clean bore group was 168SMK- 40.5 IMR 4895 it shot 1.65in 5 shot group at 200yds! My next best group was 150SMk 44.5 IMR 4064 1.75in. These groups were round and very close to zero. I guess SAI barrels can hang. I still have to get a nm spring guild and NM piston. GOOD DAY at the range. Thanks Joe.
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03...that is freaking exciting! At 1.75" at 200, we're talking .88 MOA (rounded up). That is outstanding accuracy.
Think of the BC of those 168's at long range, too...that would seriously bring the pain at long range. Thanks so much for this information.
Think of the BC of those 168's at long range, too...that would seriously bring the pain at long range. Thanks so much for this information.
I wouldn't change the spring guide or the piston. You'll hit the wall of diminishing returns.
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bd111 is right on. It don't sound like it's broke.
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Go for it. Change the two items. If no positive change, well at least you know what works and does not in your rifle. Enjoy the journey.
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Those groups are outstanding! If it ain't broke, don't fix it..........
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The spring guide is a great item to change out. It just makes everything so much smoother. The piston could go either way. No harm in trying providing you torque the gas plug the proper amount, keeping that consistent, each time you change out a piston.
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