[harley guy]

i had my tables set up at our local gun show this weekend and a guy comes wandering by with m14 slung over his shoulder. he stops to inquire about new unissued gi mags and i direct him to him to our local surplus dealer. when he turned to leave i spotted the selector switch and stopped him. after many questions, he told me it was a law enforcement buy only, brand new unissued h and r select fire m14. after some coaxing he let me examine the rifle and sure enough it was. this rifle had no handling marks of any kind, no wear on any of the metal, all the stock stampings were amazingly clear and unmolested by handling. he stated it took about a year with many followup phone calls and mailings but evidently worth the wait. this guy admitted to being a swat team member in our bordering town and when he realized i was a m14 nut from hell, he opened up to more conversion. he would not give a price but did say that other members were in the process of ordering. he was in his late twenties and had no experience with the m14, hadnt even shot this one but had plans to do so. is anybody out there familiar with this program. these are absolutely brand new rifles from our government arsenals with a law enforcement only stipulation. if i had not seen this with my own eyes, i wouldnt have believed it. anybody out there with more info on this, holler back.

 

[SixTGunr]

Class II Manufacturer and friend of mine recently purchased a couple of full auto M14s from a local law enforcement agency but these were Chinese receivers (Norinco). They are in very good shape and function flawlessly but they do not compare to what you have described.

The Military must have a warehouse full of these somewhere for sales to LEA's around the country. Must be nice ..... :wink:

Six

 

[SixTGunr]

Its the same program that allows departments to purchase M16A1s. That is, the rifle was not his, it was a department rifle. I sure wish I could buy one for the $30 odd dollars it cost! They come from Anninston Army depot. Some are like new, others worn. Seventh Fleet on Battlerifles department has some. Locally Pensacola PD has several for honor guard. Some state police out west have them for issue.

 

[TB]

harley guy,

Did you happen to see what manufacture this guys rifle was or rather his department rifle, just curious. I know of a guy who rents a TRW M-14 from the state to use to compete with in high power service rifle. If I remember correctly it costs him about $50 a year to rent. I have not seen the inside of the weapon so I don’t know if the selector lug has been removed or not, technically/legally it should it should have been, but the rifle does belong to the state, so who knows.

 

[harley guy]

police purchase m14

this was a new H ad R m14, fully operational selective fire rifle. the gentleman was courteous enough to let me hold and look the rifle carefully over without disturbing anything. i would have given my eye teeth to field strip this jewel. he stated it was purchased by him through a government program somethign along the line of 1336 or 1364 LEO and it was his weapon, not the departments. he also had to apply and maintain in good standing the appropriate papers in order to possess said rifle. what amazes me is that somewhere out there in government land is a batch of select fire m14 rifles that are new, never used, not even handling marks. anyone with more info on this let me know. i know i will never be given the chance to own one but would like to know all that i can about this. i shoot with some of our highway patrol boys and will try to find out more about thi through them. will post if anymore info comes my way

 

[SixTGunr]

I do belive either
A.) He is blowing smoke since there is no such program I am aware of for individual officers
Or
B.) He has had someone in the department sign off on the paperwork so that he could purchase the weapon, inferring it belongs to the agency.
I have purchased a number of SBRs for my agency. I have to fill out the form 1s to register them with the NFA. The program that allows transfer of select fire rifles only allows firearms to be transferred to the department. He may have it, but if the BATFE or NFA folks do an audit, someone is going to hang!

 

[harley guy]

police purchase m14

you could and probably are right on both counts. i cant comment on his sincerity because i never saw him before in my life. i thought it rather brazen to be walking around with the rifle but it didnt seem to bother him. my biggest question about this whole incident is that the rifles are somewhere stored in a government arsenal i presume but where? how many exist in this supreme condition? has anyone seen a brand new m14 select fire lately, especially government issue? really curious about this whole thing. thanks for the info.

 

[SixTGunr]

I could be wrong but I think the guy was full of sh_t. It is IMPOSSIBLE for an individual officer to own (in his name) a select fire weapon without an ffl. I am a leo assigned to swat and have 2 select fire weapons along with a sbr which are issued to me but belong to the dept. as far as the program for govt firearms to police dept.s i know for a fact that some small agencies are loaned/rented/leased m16s. more depts are now involved with this program as it has expanded under the new homeland defense programs. hope this helps

 

[XLIV]

Check out www.dla.mil and look under the 1033 program. The defense logistics agency/LE support office does make them available to law enforcement department/personnel.

44

 

[SixTGunr]

The DLA 1033 program is for Agencys only. I cannot go to the sheriff, and legally purchase an M14/M16 from them.
I was being polite and not saying the gentleman was full of $*&t. I have known of small agencys "bending" the law and allowing individuals to purchase firearms that are agency only firearms. When he leaves, the firearm had best be with the department or someone will hang.
There are approx. 200,000 M14s still in military hands. Some are with ROTC units. Some with the Navy. Others with ceremonial units like the 3d Regiment of Infantry (The Old Guard) Others are in storage at Anninston Army Depot in N. Alabama. There are a very large number of M16A1s also. These are a strategic stockpile for major war use. Some are transferred to law enforcement agencys through the 1033 program. Locally we get stuff from the DRMO. The last time I checked m14s were not being shipped. They are getting in short supply in servicable condition.
The Marines went through 10,000 at Crane depot to find 1000 to use as DMR basis.
Anyway, someone is breaking the law on this one any way you want to look at it.

 

[XLIV]

tks..always wondered about that. The mission statement for the section 1033 read something like 'provide surplus... to individuals who have the authority to arrest and apprehend'.

Still, it was pretty cruel of that guy to walk around a gun show with one and say "yea, never fired one before..thought it would be cool to have laying around."

44

 

[TB]

The way I understand it, an officer can legally own his own select fire M-14 or any other class III weapon for that matter as long as it is on the NFA registry, thus such a weapon would be able to be owned by any other law abiding citizen looking to be involved in the class III world. As he says he has never fired that type of weapon he probably didn’t pony up the $6000 or so for it. I would think if his department is looking to acquire them they too are not going to spend that kind of cash, but you never know. If there are some that are available through the government that are not in the NFA registry those weapons can only be owned by the government, class III dealers and manufactures and official agencies i.e. police departments so, if this guys department owned the rifle it could have been assigned to him and I suppose if he was so inclined he might wander around the show with the weapon. Or, maybe it is some wanna be with an H & R re-weld with one of Hawks kits : )

 

[harley guy]

hog67

my highway patrol budd just got back to me with the lowdown on this mysterious m14 purchase. indeed it was purchased by the police department and issued to the gentleman in question. also on order are two more for other members of their swat team. as far as him saying it was his, well thats another story and my only comment on that is arrogance and trying to impress someone isnt my cup of tea. these are purchased from the government through LO 1033 and there is considerable red tape but what isnt if you are involved in anything government.

 

[SO2315]

He is full of it. My Department has 8 of these rifles. The one I have is a TRW. We have H&R, Winchester and Springfileds's. Some were dressed in wood but most were in the gross looking synthetics.
You as an individual cannot purchase these rifles. As I understand it, the rifles we have are still Uncle Sam's. If we ever want to get rid of them they will go back to the arsenal where we picked them up.
So, I would say he is blowing smoke. It was probably issued to him, and it is his gun for official use only. I have mine with me, but would never take it to a gun show! It is a work instrument, and Uncle Sam will probably take em back if he finds out the officers are strolling through gun shows with them!

 

[SixTGunr]

Just a few thoughts: Why would a department want to issue it’s officers select fire M-14’s? Also I was not aware that Winchester made M-14s and the weapons from this particular gov’t entity might not be available to the public, but there M-14s that are.

 

[JR]

I would imagine that LEO and their Departments "want" select fire M14 rifles for the same reason they "want" select fire M16 rifles. If you've never fired one, and only seen them used in the movies, you more than likely won't find them hard to control, until you set up on the range. Neither rifle has much place in Civilian hands. I also classify LEO as "civilians", despite the apparent distinction that some have evolved. Full-auto fire hasn't much place in your urban setting, too many non-combatant parties around. The M14 would have some advantages in that scenario, as a semi-auto rifle. The .308 would be of much greater value against armored opponents, and their vehicles. It also penetrates glass with LESS deviation than the 5.56 round.
I also think that the full-auto capability may have been a feature "included" in the package. For $30.00 you got a fully operational weapon, spare parts, and extra magazines. That alone could make them VERY attractive to budget conscious Police Officials.
The Officer in question could well have been feeling a testosterone fueled surge of importance. Not all LEOs are quite that self-important, in fact, not many are anything but people just like us. That IS the way it should be.

 

[SO2315]

Our dept M-14's have the selector pinned in place by Uncle Sam. Yes we could get the parts to make em full auto, but WHY???
Anyone with any experience knows that full auto is worthless, and placed precision shots is what you want. Classic case, and lucky for the LAPD were those two idiots at the Hollywood bank. How many police fatalities did they incur? NONE!!