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Discussion Starter #1
Finally got an M14 and took it to the range for the first time, today. Already facing some problems and I could sure use some help.

LRB receiver, all winchester USGI parts, M14E2 stock, rifle was built by Ted Brown. Bought from another member of this forum who says that there are only 40 previous rounds through it and it looks like it.

Used german surplus ammo (DAG93)

Used two five round and one 25 round magazine purchased from 44mag.

Rifle was properly lubed with some light grease, I may be a newbie when it comes to M14s but I know how to properly lube a weapon and not over do it.


From the get go I can tell this rifle is a shooter, really close grouping and great potential. Also from the get go, the rifle ejects just fine but was not feeding. The bolt would cycle but it wasn't picking up the rounds out of the magazine. I tried all three magazines and had the same problem out of all of them. I had to pull the bolt back after every shot so that it would feed correctly. Got her sighted in and took her to the hundred yard line, was trying to get her dialed in and had to continue cycling it manually to feed it (it continued ejecting on its own).

Also worth note, a fellow shooter wanted to put up a target. I tried to clear my weapon but was not able to clear the chamber, the op rod and bolt would not move back. I tried my best to pull the bolt back but it wouldn't budge. I decided to fire the weapon and see if it would loosen up. It fired and ejected just fine.

I should have quit at that point but I was stupid and decided to fire a few more rounds, about three rounds later the weapon didn't eject after firing. The bolt got about 1/3 of the way back and was stuck. I couldn't force the bolt back, even when tapping the op rod handle with a rubber mallet.

I didn't want to tap any harder so I now have a stuck bolt. Not sure where to go from here but I figure no point in digging myself any deeper. Can you help a newbie out?
 

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Just a thought, did you try and remove the trigger assy to see if it would loosen up or come out of the stock? I am no expert, but that is what I would have tried.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I sure hope so. I've waited 3 years to get an m14 for myself and I love it so I'm really bummed to be having these problems.

One last thing, I did make sure that the magazines were seated properly...I am a dumb marine but I'm pretty sure they were inserted correctly.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Just a thought, did you try and remove the trigger assy to see if it would loosen up or come out of the stock? I am no expert, but that is what I would have tried.
I did remove the trigger assembly. I did not remove the receiver group from the stock.
 

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Did you try tapping the op rod forward instead of back? It may be digging in deeper going back and needs to go forward to unbind itself.

Was the ammo clean and dry?

I'd talk to Ted and start asking a lot of questions. Headspace would be the first question. A tight match chamber with NATO ammo can lead to bad things.

Pics would definitely help.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Did you try tapping the op rod forward instead of back? It may be digging in deeper going back and needs to go forward to unbind itself.

Was the ammo clean and dry?

I'd talk to Ted and start asking a lot of questions. Headspace would be the first question. A tight match chamber with NATO ammo can lead to bad things.

Pics would definitely help.
I did tap it forward, but when I tap it back it won't budge more than about a half an inch back.

Guess I'll have to call Ted after the holidays, I didn't think about head spacing.

I'll post some pics either today or tomorrow.
 

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While we are waiting for the experts to weigh in, maybe you could remove the action from the stock and see how the op rod is lining up with the gas piston. Maybe it is way off, far enough for the op rod to bind in the op rod guide or crooked enough to cause binding of the op rod in the slide.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
While we are waiting for the experts to weigh in, maybe you could remove the action from the stock and see how the op rod is lining up with the gas piston. Maybe it is way off, far enough for the op rod to bind in the op rod guide or crooked enough to cause binding of the op rod in the slide.
Op rod doesn't appear to be crooked or off. Here are a few pics.







 

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Have you tried to removed the Op Rod spring and guide?
 

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From your description it sounds like the bolt isn't cycling all the way or not at all.

Make sure the spindle valve is in the open position on the gas cylinder.

Also with the bolt locked back can you hear the gas piston slide back and forth while tilting the gun muzzle up and then muzzle down? If not maybe the gas system is fowled.

Take out the gas piston and stick a #48 (0.076") drill bit into the hole into the bottom of the gas cylinder. It should go in freely and far enough to pass through the spindle valve and into the bore of the barrel. If it doesn't the ports are not aligned or clogged with something or the spindle valve is closed.

Hope this helps.

BTW the only other thing I think it could be is a rough chamber or a bad extractor or weak extractor spring. These may cause the claw of the extractor to slip off the rim of the chambered round. However, if you are beating on the op rod handle to eject chambered rounds it sounds unlikely that it is the extractor and more likely a rough chamber.

A final thought. If the rifle is short cycling then it might be jamming the fired shell back into the chamber. I was dumb enough to chamber a fired shell into my rifle once and I had a heck of a time ejecting it. I had to hit the op rod handle with a rubber mallet.

Hope this helps.
 

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You got me. But, with that said here is an experience that a friend had that is similar to what you have going on. Only his rifle wouldn't cycle at all from the first round. And the gas port was in the open position BTW.

To make a very long story short, the problem ended up being too much oil in the chamber from storage. The case hydro'ed in the chamber. Just stuck itself right like you have yours in the pics. He used a rubber mallet to get the round out. Use caution while doing that, if you feel compelled to try it, more than you already have.

I don't think this is your problem, as you shot it several times.

Try thinking back to that last round you shot. Did the recoil seem more than normal? Like it was a heavier than normal load? If it WAS, then you may have a case that just decided to get stuck. Usually the extractor rips the rim off the case, but some brass can be pretty strong causing this problem. NoExpert may be onto something if you have a tighter match chamber in your rifle. Mil-surp ammo may be a no-go for this particular barrel/rifle if you find out this is the type of chamber you have.

Also, since your bolt is stuck, you can't obviously get the oprod out, but you can take the spring guide out, and also remove your gas piston. It may help to use a wooden dowel the right size to fit thru the gas block and see if you can hit the oprod that way. Be VERY careful if you try this method though. This might help as you aren't hitting the finger hook on the side potentially damaging it, and you are driving it like it functions. (I hope this makes sense.)

One more thing. Is there any play, or slop in the oprod guide that is attached to the barrel? It is that round "thing" that the oprod runs thru. Check that for any movement. It should be rock solid. I'm pretty confident it is tho, but that could be binding on the oprod potentially. Pretty unlikely, but anything is possible.

Best of luck, I know how frustrated you probably are. Remember, if you get too hot headed, just walk away for a while, and come back to it later. It WILL work out one way or another, just be patient. GI7
 

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Ain't no such thing as "Dumb Marine" . . Thank you, Sir, for your service to this Great Nation.

I have nothing to add to help you, just wanted to say welcome and thank you . .

The guys here are the smartest M14 guys on this planet. they will get you on the road to M14 perfection . . .

Peace, Out \ /

and a Merry Christmas.
 

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My guess is that all your problems are ammo related.
Once you get that round out and clean the rifle up it will work fine with the ammo it likes.
 

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thats why it is always good to field strip your gun and inspect it before you shoot it. beautiful rifle by the way! nice stock! my first guess would be, since the gun was made from "parts" that something is out of spec........like the bolt.? yes i know they are all GI parts, but still. with the action out of the stock, can you work the op rod? does it function in your hand w/o firing ect...

if everything appears to function ok when handling, i would say the bolt is the problem. i would say, check your piston because at first it sounded like a gas problem.....but when you said "the bolt froze half way back" then my guess would be the bolt is bad.........check the roller on the bolt. is it smooth? is the action stiff? is it sliding into battery all the way?

i will watch this thread and wait for more feedback.....but my guess is the bolt is bad or the op rod is bent.
 

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CE1371! What Brand of Magazines are You using? What kind of Barrel is on the Weapon?
What ever Problem You are having, We can get You straightened out, if it is Receiver related I am sure Ted can take care of it, but I think that You either have a Magazine Problem or a Chamber Problem with 7.62X51 Ammo, that's why I asked what kind of Barrel is on the Weapon!
PS a lot of the Civilian Barrels come with Short Chambers and won't cycle with 7.62X51 Ammo, also like the Poster above suggested, try the Tilt Test and make sure Your Spindle Valve is UP and Down, Don't worry the DAG is Fine Ammo, it has nothing to do with the malfunctioning of You Weapon!
 

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and ditto on what budsboy said........i think a m14 should eat anything you feed it, but i would break the gun in with something other than surplus ammo. you are not using that bimetal jacket german stuff are you? the silver tip looking bullets....?

i would trust LRB and Winchester before i would trust the credit rating on some old surplus ammo. bad ammo maybe?

was the ammo greasy or dirty? did the ammo have dings in the casings?
 

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<<<<<<<I had to pull the bolt back after every shot so that it would feed correctly...>>>>>>>>>

It sounds like your M-14 is short stroking since it isn't picking up a round when the bolt goes back into battery. This is most likely caused by a dirty or out of spec gas tube assembly or piston.

Since your bolt is stuck closed, with a fired case in the chamber, this may be caused by defective ammo or a bad chamber. You might consider using a steel cleaning rod inserted into the barrel and then use a rubber mallet to hit the end of the cleaning rod, while someone else is pulling back on the oprod handle to get the stuck case out of the chamber.

Once the chamber is clear, then take the gas system off the weapon and make sure it's clean as a pin with no lube at all inside the gas tube assembly. Then put it back on, making sure the hole in the barrel is lined up correctly with the hole in the gas tube assembly. Make sure the spindle valve is in the correct position and not in the grenade launching position. Check your chamber with a bright light, making sure it's clean, unscoured and free of lubricant.

Put your weapon back together and lubricate it properly, making sure the op rod is well lubed with grease, inside and out. Lube the bolt, op rod channel, and trigger assembly with grease. Get some good quality, clean, 7.62 NATO ammo and see how your weapon will run after you've gone through it completely. Keep us posted. The M-14 is a simple, robust, easily maintained weapon and odds are you can straighten it out yourself.

Let us know how it turns out.

Merry Christmas

7th
 

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I have had some do this before. From the pictures, it appears yours might have the same problem.

The back left side of the bolt has an ear on it which rides in the groove and guides the bolt on its travel rearward, actually it just keeps it from jumping out.

Yours looks like it is hitting the bolt stop and would cause these choked down efforts at picking up the next round by robbing inertia from the traveling bolt, so that it would eject, but not far enough to pick up the next round.

Extreme caution is advised when trying to bump bolt back forward again if you have a live round.

Try to get the op rod spring guide out by retracting the connector pin, then take a very small screwdriver or probe of some sort and come in from the left side through the bolt stop slot, and pry down on the bolt stop to see if it is stopping the bolts movement rearward.

If you get it disassembled, leave it apart and put the bolt back in and work the path of travel, watching the bolt stop area closely. Sometimes the receiver area where the bolt stop lies at rest and level, where the spring forces it, is not machined level enough and has a high spot. This is where I would look first.

Sometimes you will need to grind a bit off the bolt stop, or receiver "lastly" to level it up. there is no pressure at this location on the receiver bridge so you need not worry about the hardness there, besides, you will not need to take that much probably, the hardness is between 15-18 thousanths thick, you will need no more than .005

If it does, send it back to LRB...Lou should be able to fix you up..He stands behind his work.

Also, I would clean the chamber with a chamber brush real well and mop out and do a headspace check. If Ted did indeed build it, it might have a tighter headspace for a match rifle, and mil-surp is a no go deal. This does not explain failure to feed though unless your spindle valve assembly is unitized and leaking somewhere robbing gas, or spindle valve is clogged or turned partly off. Too powerful an op rod spring will do this also, but should work with powerful mil-surp. Please keep us posted after you try these things.
 
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