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It's a great shooting rifle when it works.

2756 Views 24 Replies 13 Participants Last post by  flip180
I took out my scout/squad out today and had some real bad issues with failure to extract. I'm talking a failure rate of greater than 30% out of 80 rounds. There was a time or three where I had to kick the charging handle with my boot to get the action to open. On those times, I would drop the mag and release the bolt to regrasp the fired case with the extractor in order to get it out of the gun. When the case wouldn't release from the chamber, I had to give it the boot literally. I was using South African ammo today and I don't think that the ammo is the sole cause. I have a feeling the extractor or something related to it is to blame. The rifle would try to double feed. The bolt would recoil back leaving the fired case in the chamber and move forward to try to feed the next round. Any one have any suggestions?

Thanks, Flip.
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Chamber?

Flip, get a good light in there and look at the chamber - it sounds either gunked up or rough enough to grasp the case. The bolt seems to be operating as it should from your discription...

Let us know
On the good side,

this thing is the cat's meow. It litterally has no muzzle climb at all due to the comp on the end of the barrel. It is also loud as hell. I mean "BOOM". I was alone until a couple of guys the pulled up and started to shoot clay pigeons with shotguns. I was kicking back trying to figure out the problem when they arrived. After a couple of their salvos with the scatter guns, I loaded up and sent a few down range. I have electronic hearing protection so, I can hear people on the far end talking even when there is shooting going on. I couldn't catch exactly what they were saying because they were wispering and they were 75 feet from me but, I know they were commenting about the report of that short barreled M1A going off. I wonder how loud this thing is when standing next to it.

Flip.
We'll get it working........

I had my Scout out today, also - it is more fun than a circus pony! How does the chamber look?
Chamber or gas system

A good scrubbing of the chamber with a chamber brush. Check the gas piston, a dirty gas system will mess you up real quick! These are the simple things you can check, real quick. GI2
+one more, it sounds like it's gunked up.
I believe I saw a prior post on your sweetheart in that you were waiting on your "new" rifle to arrive ...

I'm confident that once you get her broke in and tweaked out here and there she will be just fine.

Evereyone has given you some good advice at what to look for as far as the gas system and a good cleaning. Theres always the possibility of a bad extractor as well but try the simpler things first during an elimination process.

You'll be happier than a pig in the mud once she starts running like a Swiss clock. GI2

Keep us posted and congrats on your new toy.

Six
I tried to clean out the chamber as best I could before firing and while those other guys were shooting their shotguns. I'm surprised that this gun didn't come with any type of cleaning kit let alone a chamber brush. I'll tr to get it apart in the next couple of days to take a look at the gas system also. I was surprised that this gun jammed in the first three rounds while sighting it in.

Thanks, Flip.
failure to extract

Sir, I have had a similar problem using SA ammo in an Armscorp scout w/out sufficient lubrication. After I properly lubed up, problem went away. Good luck.
Flip - I agree - it sounds to me as if this is a cleaning issue. I'm curious as to how many rounds you have down range and if you properly lubed it up before you shot it. They don't come from the factory ready to roll. It also sounds as if you don't have the proper cleaning tools, so I'd grab some post-haste. Let us know how it works out and post pics if you can...Congrats on the rifle by the way - Scouts are sweet.

If you think the Scout is loud, stand next to a SOCOM - it'll knock your hat off....This winter I was blowing snow off the range roof, now It's pine needles and when I go prone, it looks like I literally rake the debris from in front of my lane... GI6
I think I have alot to learn. It's nice to have sites like this that are specific to a particular firearm. I'll do some searching in the next few days on this sight to learn more about maintaining the rifle and lubrication. BTW, I calles SA and they said the probem was ammo related. I'll see if I can rule that out.

Thanks, Flip
flip180 said:
I think I have alot to learn. It's nice to have sites like this that are specific to a particular firearm. I'll do some searching in the next few days on this sight to learn more about maintaining the rifle and lubrication. BTW, I calles SA and they said the probem was ammo related. I'll see if I can rule that out.

Thanks, Flip
You'll be amazed at how easy this rifle is to maintain, once you learn how. I have had a truckload of guns through the years, but never an M1 platform. I was a bit intimidated at first and it seemed like I was posting questions, or sending PM's to my friend every 5-minutes.

Just remember one thing....grease. When I first got my SOCOM, I used regular oil with poor results. Once I read and learned about the wonders of grease, I haven't looked back. This thing runs like a top.

Good luck and again - welcome to the club!

Where's the pics??? GI6

PS: I bet you a box of donuts that it's not the ammo. SA runs like a champ.
MassMark

What kinds of problems were you having before switching to grease?

Flip.
flip180 said:
What kinds of problems were you having before switching to grease?

Flip.
No real problems perse, but the first trip to the range was an eye opener. Firts and foremost, I had bad mags that I picked up at a gun show. I knew nothing about M1A mags and got a lesson in what kind of junk is to be had out there, so I was stuck with the factory 10rd.

I essentially did the same as you, took the SOCOM out of the box, cleaned it up, oiled it and headed to the range. After I realized my mags were crap, I started in with the 10's. I got a bit farther, but at around 100, I started to get FTE's and a few FTF's. The action would also lock back and I'd have to slap the op rod back into battery.

I thought: "this gun is crapola".... I was wrong. A phone call to a friend of mine and an E-mail later, I had the gun broken down and really gave it a good cleaning. Had I only read more carefully before I headed to the range, I would have saved myself a bad range day. I had too much oil on the bolt and subsequently the chamber. It got gunked up and gave me trouble.

Since then, I've done three things: I've read everything on the net I could, picked up tools, (M1A Survival Kit) and Scott Duff's book.

I use the grease on the roller, bolt, grooves, op rod guide, spring, guide, anything that moves, (except the piston, tube etc)- that should be dry. I'm also careful around the bolt face/chamber - it's squeaky clean but ungreased. I also put a dab on my forward mount to ease contact between the oprod and the corner of the mount.

Since then, this thing runs like a top and requires very little in the way of cleaning. I'm well over 600-rounds without a complete take-down. In fact, match shooters I believe take their rifles apart once a year.

The grease doesn't break down like oil and keeps it running smooth as butter....
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Thinking back,

When at the range, I would get tired of locking the bolt back to drop the mag in order to clear the malfunction. I shot single shot for a good twenty rounds with out a single extraction problem. When I loaded up the ten rounder, the extraction problems were 2-3 per mag. I'm not new to guns and knoiw the mag shouldn't have anything to do with extraction but, I find it odd that this didn't happen with only one round in the magazine firing single shot.

Flip.
Actually, I've found the magazine has a lot to with more than you would think. Magazines can put different pressures on the bolt slowing the operation down.
I ordered a butstock cleaning kit on-line and have some Tetra gun grease on the way through my local gunstore. I gave the gun a thorough cleaning a couple of nights ago and will clean the chamber properly with the chamber brush when the cleaning kit comes in. I will grease it up as previously described by MassMark and have another go at it with the ten rounder in the gun. If that doesn't do it, I have seven 20 round USGI mags on the way from Armalite and will see what those do when they come in.

Thanks, Flip.
magazines are a definite weak link... good magazines are critical.... I have had problems with magazines just because of the magazines.. case in point.. when i was in the army reserve, i almost did not qualify on the m16 because of bad magazines causing on jam after another... after i had qualified, the range officer checked my weapon by putting another magazine in it the weapon functioned flawlessly... unfortunately because i had qaulified i could not requalify.

by comparision when i was in the marines, I had excellent magazines and despite being sick and needing glasses i still shot a 214 which got me high sharpshooter. so magazines are a definite issue to contend with in regards to magazine fed weapons...
Be sure to put a light coating of grease on the bottom of the bolt.
flip180 said:
I ordered a butstock cleaning kit on-line and have some Tetra gun grease on the way through my local gunstore. I gave the gun a thorough cleaning a couple of nights ago and will clean the chamber properly with the chamber brush when the cleaning kit comes in. I will grease it up as previously described by MassMark and have another go at it with the ten rounder in the gun. If that doesn't do it, I have seven 20 round USGI mags on the way from Armalite and will see what those do when they come in.

Thanks, Flip.
Cleaning the chamber is one thing and using that issue M14 cleaning kit to run your barrel is another. I and many wouldn't recommend it as that steel rod is very rough on the barrel and crown damage is a definite concern. If you mess up your crown you'll see your accuracy fly out the window.
You might think about getting a OTIS kit which will let you clean from the chamber to the muzzle and protect your barrel crown. If not that than a good rod and bore guide like Dewey's would be my next choice.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/16789-19977-857.html


http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=5641&title=COATED+RODS
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