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XM80C vs XM80CL
The difference is the "L" but can someone who knows please tell me the real difference.
It's not a huge deal to know...but it's driving me nuts.

Thanks errbody

Deuces,
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Type of packaging, maybe. Maybe one is by the box and the other sold by the case, or something like that?
 

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All I could see that was different was the printing on the boxes "XM80C vs XM80CL" and CL cost 15-17¢ more per round. Both manufactured at the Lake City Plant, both 149 grain.

GI3
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Awesome. Thanks fellas

Deuces
 

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Just bought some today. wanted to know myself what the difference was. gun range here was selling them(xm80c) cheap because they are/suppose to be bimetal jacket? as for teh xm80cl, anyone know why the different packaging? the xm80c and xm80cl are the same. what metal? copper and......copper and.........copper and.....
 

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Not "bimetal", but rather, Gilding Metal Clad Steel (GMCS). A sandwich of gilding/steel/gilding that is bonded under high pressure. Discs are punched out and the jacket formed in the standard way. The exact proportions can vary slightly but 15/80/5 is typical. (15% GM on the outside, 80% steel, 5% GM on the inside.

Foreign bullets are another thing altogether.

Ray
 

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As Ray stated above, it all starts with the head stamp. And LOT numbers can also be informative: "LC" (LAKE CITY: military) & "FC" (FEDERAL Cartridge: commercial/military contract). But the actual meaning of the "SMQ" LOT number prefix on both military & commercial sales (CS) ammunition is still a question mark. "SMQ" possibly references "Statement of Minimum Qualification" but I have seen no published info on what it actually signifies. The important part to shooters: DOD shooters have confirmed their use of both "LC" & "SMQ" prefix LOT M118LR as a combat cartridge so "SMQ" indicates full "mil-spec" quality ammunition in at least some cases. Problem is CS ammunition has been coming out of Federal/ATK with "SMQ" prefix LOT numbers for over a decade now. And CS ammunition does not go thru mil-spec ammunition inspection protocol so can not possibly be "mil-spec" ammunition.
LOT numbers are used to track problems with batches of ammunition. If ammunition is not of a high enough quality to rate an legitimate LOT number, I have no use for it other than to be used as blasting/practice ammo. I view LOT number as ammunition pedigree: an important indicator of quality.
 

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leid

Over the years, there has been a lot of speculation and discussion as to the meaning of "SMQ" in lot numbers. Guys have come up with guesses that ranged from logical to ridiculous. So, about 5 years ago I decided to go directly to the source, Lake City AAP. I received an email response from the Program Manager, Commercial Sales, that was short and sweet:

"SMQ in the lot number assigned simply means that the lot was produced for a commercial order, as opposed to the LC that appears in lots produced for the U. S. Government"

In other correspondence with his office I was told that "XM" signifies contract overruns, and "PD" means bulk packaging.

One of the unfortunate things about these acronyms is that they are also used to mean other things. "XM" is the military code for experimental and SMQ is the manufacturing code for Saint Marks Powder. PD often refers to pull down ammunition.

Is this the final word? I doubt it, but it's the best I can come up with for now and I'm sticking with it until shown otherwise.

Ray
 

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leid

Over the years, there has been a lot of speculation and discussion as to the meaning of "SMQ" in lot numbers. Guys have come up with guesses that ranged from logical to ridiculous. So, about 5 years ago I decided to go directly to the source, Lake City AAP. I received an email response from the Program Manager, Commercial Sales, that was short and sweet:

"SMQ in the lot number assigned simply means that the lot was produced for a commercial order, as opposed to the LC that appears in lots produced for the U. S. Government"

In other correspondence with his office I was told that "XM" signifies contract overruns, and "PD" means bulk packaging.

One of the unfortunate things about these acronyms is that they are also used to mean other things. "XM" is the military code for experimental and SMQ is the manufacturing code for Saint Marks Powder. PD often refers to pull down ammunition.

Is this the final word? I doubt it, but it's the best I can come up with for now and I'm sticking with it until shown otherwise.

Ray
Ray,
As always, I appreciate the education. And I well know you seek the most credible information available. But LCAAP's explanation(s) just doesn't always pass the "sniff" test. IE: XM118PD in 20 round boxes is not bulk packaging & early XM855PD was some very sad ammunition. I feel there may be a bit of underlying salesmanship involved in their response: definitely not the full disclosure we would like. I do feel I can trust LC & SMQ LOT numbered ammunition to be of high quality but still view most FC LOTS as commercial sales ammunition with a lower standard of quality control. JMHO

Carey
 

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As I said, it's not likely to be the final word, but it will have to do until something better comes along.

I have several 20-round cartons of XM118PD and I believe the acronyms fit the explanation given to me. The cartridges all have LC LR head stamps which can mean they are overruns. The headstamp years are mixed in each carton and vary from 01 to 05 (as I remember), and I think that is what is meant by bulk packaging.

As I said, it doesn't help that the acronyms have other meanings. And if that's not bad enough, commercial manufacturers (particularly Federal) use that same darn "XM" on many of their products, and not just those that are true overruns from Lake City. Toss in all of the shooters who still think that Lake City and Federal are one and the same and there's no end to the confusion.

Ray
 

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Federal Lake City 7.62x51 XM80CL 149 Grain Full Metal Jacket


Each round is brass-cased, boxer-primed, non-corrosive, and reloadable. It is both economical and precision manufactured in the USA. Please note: This product has 2 different product codes: XM80C is packaged in Anoka, MN....XM80CL is packaged in Lake City, MO. Both products are manufactured in Lake City, MO and are loaded to the same exact specs
 

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XM80C vs XM80CL
The difference is the "L" but can someone who knows please tell me the real difference.
It's not a huge deal to know...but it's driving me nuts.

Thanks errbody

Deuces,
Rooster
For what it's worth, I just took receipt of 50 boxes of this stuff. The cartridge cases all bear the makrs of having spent some time in M13 links. The ammo I received came in white Federal 20rd boxes, adn head stamped "LC 14". These rounds were absolutely pulled from links and boxed up.
 

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I just picked up 3 boxes of the XM80CL rounds in the 20/pack. When I was looking at the individual rounds I noticed the link marks as well. Having been on many crew serve weapons in my day (the M60) being one of those I would agree with the previous post. My guess is the rounds are bought back from government service after the military's expiration date kicks in. I don't mind, and I hope know one else does either; I'll shoot an inexpensive target round any day. I did note that the bottom of my round was imprinted with "LC 15" not "LC 14". Another mystery to ponder.........
 
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