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Help, advice needed, what scope should I get?

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Hello. I need some quick advice. I am scheduled to take a precision rifle course in May of this year. Although I have been shooting a rifle for over 20 yrs. I have never shot one with a scope before. I am now faced with the difficult task of choosing a scope for my rifle. Since I have never used a scope before and there are so many choices a friend suggested I ask around on this web site as there were many knowledgeable people who could probably be of help.

The rifle I am taking is a Polytech M-14. I sent it to Fulton Armory for their Chineese Upgrade Package. Since then, it seems to function fine and shoot straight. I can consistantly hit a 12X 8 steel plate at 90 yds. The class instructor suggested I not "spend a lot of money for a scope just for this class". Since this will be an Urban Precision Rifle course we will not be shooting beyond 200 yds. Any advice would be most appreciated. I really need to make a decision within the next week or so. Thank you in advance for your time and consideration.
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Welcome to the forum

Welcome to the forum - you might want to try making friends with the iron sights first and then decide what optics you might need for your shooting requirements. Again, Welcome!
 

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Not being a jerk here, but do you need a scope?

I have typical middle-aged eyes (now -3.00 left, -2.75 right (shooting eye) w/ a bit of astigmatism) and with some practice over the past 9 months, am frankly pretty decent at 200 with irons. Field positions, etc....

I'd be tempted to go with the irons, if it were me.

PS: Pls be sure and post a "range report" re your class...I am envious of you!
 

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Aloha Dr. G:

Can you elaborate on what is to be expected in this Precision Rifle course? What kind of targets are you likely to be shooting at? Will exact shot placement be a requirement?

I do agree with your instructor though and would not buy a scope "just" to take this course... however...

On an M14 type rifle if a scope is required, a good mount and rings are also equally essential and will invariably raise the cost of shooting this class.

A good setup and probably one of the more economical would be getting an ARMS #18 mount (~$160), TPS rings (~$60) and a Super Sniper scope from SWFA (which run about $299 plus shipping and options). All of which can be purchased used at discounted or used prices saving you some money.

Another alternative to a standard type scope if exact shot placement is not a requirement, is an EOTECH or Aimpoint. Both do extremely well inside of 200 yds, quick, durable but does not allow you to necessarily have exact shot placement at 200 yds although with practice you could get pretty precise hits.

I guess maybe more information may be of some help here for us to help (by suggesting) what you might want to consider.

Aloha and Good Luck,

Tom O.
 

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Also, If you install a scope you will need to add a cheek piece of some sort to the stock to get your eye up in line with the scope.
I have a scope for my M1A (Spingfield Armory 6X) but I shoot better with the iron's because I do not have an elevated cheek piece YET.
By the way WELCOME to the forum :D
 

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This precision rifle course you are going to take. Is it for gas guns or any high power rifle. If you are only going to use the scope for the class, you may want to consider using a bolt rifle that is scoped out. If you don't have a bolt gun, you may be able to borrow one or spend a few hundred on a Savage. They are incredibly accurate for the price. BTW, if you scope out your M14, you my just get to where you really like it and either get QD rings or buy another M14 :D . I hope you have a very understanding wife, I see a closet full of rifles in your future :lol: .
 

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Scope

I have found the Sightron S1 3X-9X mildot to be an excellent piece of equipment. Midway sells these for around $180 but often puts them on sale for around $130. Superb glass for the money. I use an ARMS 18 with Burris medium Signature Zee rings. This setup is as low as you can get without removing the rear-site aperture but you will still need some type of cheek-piece for the buttstock. I built up one with bondo on a GI synthetic but the strap on Scope-Eze form Brownell's is also excellent. HTH

 

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I vote for the Eotech
Urban Rifle (IIRC) calls for fast target acquisition and hits, The Eotech will give you these at 200 yards or less You don't need a cheek weld, you keep both eyes open so you have a wide field of vision and once you have the Eotech zeroed--If the red dot is on the target, you will hit it. If you can find it get a GG&G Accucam mount for your Eotech. That way, if you do need to switch to iron sights you just throw a lever and take the whole unit off and drop it in a pocket
Get a Smith Enterprise see thru mount and you're set
Of course, this costs a few bucks About $700 for everything, but you will have a great setup for this course
About $400 for the top Eotech
$85 for the Accucam
$220 for the SEI mount
ebay seems to have the best deals on eotechs and IIRC the Accucam only works with the AA battery Eotechs due to their longer bodies
Another plus of this setup is you can get a scope with QD rings and swap between Iron, Eotech or Glass
Then you are set for everything

\:D/
 

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Scope and mount

There is as many combinations that a person can think of.Looking at different optimum choices, mine was Aims # 18 base, Leupold Quick Release mount, and VX-ll 2-7x33mm with stoney point for come up and range shooting ( 200-500 yds.)
 

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honestly, stick with the mounting options described above ;) , but for 200yd URT, i'd personally go with a medium-eye-relief fixed low (between 1.5x and 3x) power scope [Leupold, but that's me], or an Aimpoint with whatever dot size your rifle groups (if your rifle shoots 2moa, get the 2moa dot).

the low power scope gives you just enough magnification to be able to accurately engage targets that far, without seriously decreasing your field of view. it also allows you to keep both eyes open at closer ranges without that weird two focal point problem.

just my $.02

chris
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thank you all for welcoming me to this forum. I truly appriciate all of the advice given so far. I feel at least as though I have some basis in which to make a decision.

In response to dighawaii's questions regarding this class. I believe we will be shooting at some steel targets but some paper targets as well. This is a precision rifle course and therefore exact shot placement will be needed. I would definetly want an EOTECH sight for a general combat senario, but my understanding is that the shot placement for this course will be very specific, which is why I need a scope. I once read a review from someone who took this course. I remember the author saying that at one point they had to make three shots in a total of thirty minutes at about 200 yds. but only had a three second window for each of their three shots, the rest of the time you are just waiting for the target to present itself. When the target did present itself it was an image of half of a hostage taker's head hiding behind a hostage. Beyond that I really can't truthfully say much more. However, as a result of your questions I will give the school a call and get more information.

Thanks again for all of your advise and makeing me feel welcome.
 

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Dr.G, I would go to the scopes and accessories board and read about the optics and mounts others are using. I have an ARMS#18 mount and love it. The SEI mounts as well as the Armscorp and other Brookfield type mounts are very solid. I have only owned 3 scope mounts made for the M14. The first two are cheaper; B-Square & S.A. 3rd generation, but if I was happy with them I would not have bought the ARMS mount. It sits very low and looks like it is part of the receiver. With a set of QD rings you can leave the mount on and simply remove or add a scope for the type of shooting you plan on doing. For 200 yard shots I wouldn't go with real high magnification. Somewhere between 4 & 6 power will give you all the magnification you need. The lower the power the brighter, faster & better field of view your going to have. Decide if you are going to use the scope & mount again when deciding how much money you are willing to part with. If you get a good mount and a decent scope, I think your going to like, so if you get a really cheap piece of glass, you'll probably end up upgrading later. I love the option of shooting with glass or irons and only have to turn the throw levers to have my pick. Good luck with you course and purchase. P.M. someone if you want to know wore about their setup.
 

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For your purpose, I would go with a Leupold compact, rifleman or VX-II/III in adjustable power. This will give you wide field of view for the shots under 100, and with plenty of magnification to reliably hit 3"- at 2-300.

You can get the Leupold compact 3x9 for around $250. The riflemans are about the same. The VX cost $3-600 plus. The really nice Mark4 scopes cost $1,000+.

For a mount, I would go with an ARMS18 or SEI see-thru. I would use quick release rings. Easy to change to a red dot, or keep the rifle light.
 

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Hi There - Welcome Aboard the Firing Line - hope your school goes well.

Doc Dighawaii and Jack Orr are giving you some really good advice about a scope. I've got an Arms #18, #22M QD mounts and a 16X Super Sniper scope from SWFA and love them.

I can shoot at paper with or without the glass and remount the scope without a change in POI. Shooting with irons is no problem with the ARMS #18.

You probably don't want that much magnification with your scope, but the Super Sniper scope comes in magnification levels of 10X, 16X and 20X. I got the accessory pack with mine and I love it.

Here are some pics of the whole package including the optional shade and ARD.









BTW, you will need a good cheek piece for scope shooting with your M!A. You might want to contact Six about the Rooster Cheek Rest.

Anyway - Pull up a chair and we'll set a place at the table for ya. =D>

db
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Help. need advice, what scope should I get

I would like to offer my sincere thanks to all of you who shared your knowledge and wisdom on the post. Based on the advice I received I feel that I have been empowered to make an informed decision. What I have finally setteled on is an ARMS#18 mount, and a Leupold VX1 3-9X40 scope with quick detatchable rings. Thanks again. :D
 
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