[yellowthunder]

Alright I’m going to put myself out here,
I didn’t want to sound like I haven’t done some research before asking this question so here we go. I hope I placed this thread in the right place GI3

I’ve just ordered a bunch of parts to include a receiver, barrel, and bolt. I really like building things and I’ve assembled several AR15’s in the past. Now, I’ve read Walt Kuleck’s M14 Complete assembly guide over and over again concerning barrel timing, parts inspection, Bolt Lapping, head spacing and how absolutely critical it is. I’ve also dug through the wealth of knowledge this forum has to offer.

I understand that I’ll need to spend some money on tools especially for performing this build, and I’ll be taking a financial risk if mistakes are made.

So here’s the question. Is it still a bad idea for me to give this a try?
I’ve done some research here and online and can’t seem to find a definitive answer.
If someone could give me some guidance that’d be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

 

[Chilly]

I think it's a bad idea, but I may be overcomplicating things. I've assembled FALs from QUALITY IN-SPEC receivers, and AR15, and Garands, but for M14 clone I punted to an expert. I think there are subtle variations in receivers that may require special attention, or at least the special gaging to ensure there are no issues. So it seems that commercial M14 receiver copies are sort of like custom pieces that usually require some hand-fitting to get it right. To build one there is no way I could purchase the tooling or gaging. And there is no way I can pay someone to infuse me with the knowledge and experience of guys who spent a good part of their life in military rifle teams building match rifles. There are rifles I'm willing and capable of building. The M14 family isn't one of them.

 

[MemphisMachinists]

Actually it is hard to justify the cost of tools to build one. You said you built several AR's so you may want to build several of these.
Where did you order your parts from?

 

[charlesPOSTLEwade]

I am no expert on Building M14's .Zero builds to my Credit
I am no expert on Building M1 Garands, however 4 flawless builds to my credit
for some reason the M14 build scares me a bit. I will send my present parts to J Wolfe to complete it. for what I have into it a few extra $ will just make me feel better.
However I will not have that Sense of Accomplishment

 

[Trung Si]

I think it's a bad idea, but I may be overcomplicating things. I've assembled FALs from QUALITY IN-SPEC receivers, and AR15, and Garands, but for M14 clone I punted to an expert. I think there are subtle variations in receivers that may require special attention, or at least the special gaging to ensure there are no issues. So it seems that commercial M14 receiver copies are sort of like custom pieces that usually require some hand-fitting to get it right. To build one there is no way I could purchase the tooling or gaging. And there is no way I can pay someone to infuse me with the knowledge and experience of guys who spent a good part of their life in military rifle teams building match rifles. There are rifles I'm willing and capable of building. The M14 family isn't one of them.

That puts it about as well as it could be said!
Putting the Sense of accomplishment aside, let me say this, while it is not a Bad Idea, it is Not a Good One, ARs, FALs or even Garands are one Thing, a Civilian 14 is an entirely Different Animal for the Reasons explained in the Quote above,besides the Money for the Tools required it is Far Cheaper to buy than to Build, one can make a $1000 Mistake in a Heartbeat, I wouldn't even trust an ordinary Gun Smith to build me a 14, I would leave that to an Experienced 14 Smith of which we have a few on this Board!ICONWINK

 

[Old Sarge]

That puts it about as well as it could be said!
Putting the Sense of accomplishment aside, let me say this, while it is not a Bad Idea, it is Not a Good One, ARs, FALs or even Garands are one Thing, a Civilian 14 is an entirely Different Animal for the Reasons explained in the Quote above,besides the Money for the Tools required it is Far Cheaper to buy than to Build, one can make a $1000 Mistake in a Heartbeat, I wouldn't even trust an ordinary Gun Smith to build me a 14, I would leave that to an Experienced 14 Smith of which we have a few on this Board!ICONWINK

I totally agree with this post. US gov't M1 and M14 receivers were carefully gauged and inspected. The required specs were much more stringent than commercially made receivers. Cost is a big factor. There is a reason SA Inc. no longer puts chrome lined barrels on their rifles. A person can easily mess up a receiver or barrel, and now you are out some serious money. A while back, Fulton Armory was advertising barreled actions with headspaced bolt, and they said "Let us do the hard part for you" and truer words were never written. The rest you can install yourself, such as rear sights, gas system, flash hider, etc.GI1

 

[M1APREBAN]

If it were me, I would send the reciever, barrel, and bolt out for assembly and headspacing. If using TRW parts, all should go together quite simply. I have built several and that is what I did for my first build. There are a few other parts that go together that require a tweak here and there, but the members here will talk you through it. Worked for me. Mike

 

[dozier]

Alright I’m going to put myself out here,
I didn’t want to sound like I haven’t done some research before asking this question so here we go. I hope I placed this thread in the right place GI3

I’ve just ordered a bunch of parts to include a receiver, barrel, and bolt. I really like building things and I’ve assembled several AR15’s in the past. Now, I’ve read Walt Kuleck’s M14 Complete assembly guide over and over again concerning barrel timing, parts inspection, Bolt Lapping, head spacing and how absolutely critical it is. I’ve also dug through the wealth of knowledge this forum has to offer.

I understand that I’ll need to spend some money on tools especially for performing this build, and I’ll be taking a financial risk if mistakes are made.

So here’s the question. Is it still a bad idea for me to give this a try?
I’ve done some research here and online and can’t seem to find a definitive answer.
If someone could give me some guidance that’d be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

If you really like to build things, my suggestion was going to be buy the bbl/receiver/and bolt as above. Have a knowledgeable GS assemble/lap/HS the components above to your/his recommended specs. From this point on, there is plenty of building/hand fitting left to be done to complete your rifle for it's intended use. The biggest cost in tooling/machinery/and the biggest expense of a mistake, is in building the above assy. Sort of like a "long block" for a race car. There is still plenty to do to make it run right. The costs of bad mistakes just cost you replacement small parts from this point on. Use the forum here for advice on buying tooling/reliable parts etc. I'd recommend Kuehnhausens Shop Manual for the build. Goes much further in depth on the build/parts specs. Good Luck, dozier

 

[buchkshot]

An excellent reason to monitor Hawk's proposed LRB group buy (see below), i.e., barrel, LRB receiver, headspaced bolt, w/ installed stripper clip guide and bolt stop. I got the CMP parts kit and agree with the knowledgable posts above concerning the M14 and it being a different animal when compared to other semi-auto firearms. The group buy, if it becomes a reality, is perfectly timed for a lot of us and would circumvent most assembly issues IMHO. Anybody got updated information on the proposed group buy?

 

[Hawk]

An excellent reason to monitor Hawk's proposed LRB group buy (see below), i.e., barrel, LRB receiver, headspaced bolt, w/ installed stripper clip guide and bolt stop.

The group buy, if it becomes a reality, is perfectly timed for a lot of us and would circumvent most assembly issues IMHO. Anybody got updated information on the proposed group buy?

Check the group buy in the group buy forum......


I have built several M14 type rifles and my best advise would be that if you don't have a M14 smith who will allow you to look over his shoulder while barreling and headspacing and allowing you to ask questions and then watch you while you do the first one, get someone reputable to do it for you. Close enough just doesn't get it. Nothing like wondering if you have done a safe build.GI8GI8GI8

Building one from scratch can be very rewarding in the self-satisfaction department, but save yourself some worry and have one of our M14 Armorers do that part. Assembling the small parts can be just as much fun.

 

[ripsaw]

Build

Alright I’m going to put myself out here,
I didn’t want to sound like I haven’t done some research before asking this question so here we go. I hope I placed this thread in the right place GI3

I’ve just ordered a bunch of parts to include a receiver, barrel, and bolt. I really like building things and I’ve assembled several AR15’s in the past. Now, I’ve read Walt Kuleck’s M14 Complete assembly guide over and over again concerning barrel timing, parts inspection, Bolt Lapping, head spacing and how absolutely critical it is. I’ve also dug through the wealth of knowledge this forum has to offer.

I understand that I’ll need to spend some money on tools especially for performing this build, and I’ll be taking a financial risk if mistakes are made.

So here’s the question. Is it still a bad idea for me to give this a try?
I’ve done some research here and online and can’t seem to find a definitive answer.
If someone could give me some guidance that’d be greatly appreciated!

Thanks!

I'm with Preban on this one and will go against the grain and overall consensus here.
Sounds to me like you are one of the guys that really likes the do it yourself type stuff.
You will never be satisfied or have that gleam in your eye until you do it yourself, besides, I don't consider it having built it yourself by having someone else do anything on it but you.

There's a special sort of feeling when you sit down at the bench and sight her in for the first time... I can't describe it, but know it feels good.....better than anything else you can do with clothes on....in comparison.

From the ground up so to speak.... You can buy a good receiver that is spec'ed out , ...and for less than $500 bucks have all the tools needed to do the job. Some here have tools you can rent for a nominal fee and you won't have to buy them.
Your barrel choice will be the biggest decision because it will need to time properly, if not you will have to turn it on the lathe to get it to time out and index right.

If you go with finished chambered barrels like Jon Wolfe's this is extremely important, if you go with short chambered barrels, the pull through reamers and finish reamers are not that expensive , nor are the bushings for your desired headspace.

I say go for it.

 

[bd111]

The only things you can't DIY without the proper tools and some experience is barreling and headspacing a bolt to what you want the as-built headspace to be. You'll need some help, possibly some spare bolts too (though this is less of a headache than with the Garand). Today's commercial M14 clone receivers by and large are pretty good, at least serviceable to excellent. You CAN order a barreled action or send your receiver and bolt to have it barreled and headspaced by one of TFL's fine sponsors or Krieger's. The rest of the build would be on your time, your parts, your labor. There's $$$ in it either way, you definitely want the best results for your investment.

 

[Essayons]

An excellent reason to monitor Hawk's proposed LRB group buy (see below), i.e., barrel, LRB receiver, headspaced bolt, w/ installed stripper clip guide and bolt stop. I got the CMP parts kit and agree with the knowledgable posts above concerning the M14 and it being a different animal when compared to other semi-auto firearms. The group buy, if it becomes a reality, is perfectly timed for a lot of us and would circumvent most assembly issues IMHO. Anybody got updated information on the proposed group buy?

I'm in the same boat as the OP, and I'm hoping to get a receiver or barreled M14SA action through the group buy. I'm still trying to decide whether to provide a Krieger to LRB arms or the LRB receiver and a bolt to Krieger. Any advice for the OP and I on that?

Edit: A closer reading of the group buy thread answered my question: "* LRB will not sell just the receiver and the bolt and barrel installation must be done by them." That makes it simple.

 

[yellowthunder]

Wow! I posted this thread late last night and this is what I wake up to! This is GREAT! I don't have a lot of time so I had to skim through real quick (Gotta go to work on Sunday). Thanks so much for the responses and advice.

I ordered an M25 LRB and currently on the waiting list since June, and I ordered a Krieger 1:10 SS Heavy Barrel.

Problem for me is I missed out on a "group" barrel buy with LRB and there's no one in Hawaii that I know of that is dependable on barreling a receiver. So my options are wait to get a barrel, receiver, bolt and send it to someone to build for me in the main land, or have all the fun for myself. The Krieger barrel will definitely have to be reamed out for proper headspacing for sure.

I'd like to write more but I gotta run. I'll be back later today!

 

[leadbug]

I am also with ripsaw with this one. I am no rifle builder (yet) but I think that if you are very interested, and good with tools and your hands, you could do it. I am planning on doing my own builds one day, but I am also going to make very sure that I understand each step very well before I dive in.

82nd ABN built his own rifles recently, and he is incredibly happy with them. I am willing to take risks to learn things, I always have been, but I always make sure I have the right information first. A properly done/safe build is first priority.

 

[Trung Si]

Wow! I posted this thread late last night and this is what I wake up to! This is GREAT! I don't have a lot of time so I had to skim through real quick (Gotta go to work on Sunday). Thanks so much for the responses and advice.

I ordered an M25 LRB and currently on the waiting list since June, and I ordered a Krieger 1:10 SS Heavy Barrel.

Problem for me is I missed out on a "group" barrel buy with LRB and there's no one in Hawaii that I know of that is dependable on barreling a receiver. So my options are wait to get a barrel, receiver, bolt and send it to someone to build for me in the main land, or have all the fun for myself. The Krieger barrel will definitely have to be reamed out for proper headspacing for sure.

I'd like to write more but I gotta run. I'll be back later today!

My suggestion is that You contact Member "dighawaii", He is located in Hawaii and and knows more about the 14 than a lot of us, He can probably help You!

 

[brycom1]

Go ahead and build it. I built mine and it has been a rewarding experience. I didn't have one ioda of experience but just read up and took my time and made a great shooter. The only problem is I want to build all of my future guns.

 

[Hawk]

My suggestion is that You contact Member "dighawaii", He is located in Hawaii and and knows more about the 14 than a lot of us, He can probably help You!

I second the above.......Tom O. purchased my vice and wrench as I can no longer afford to build a rifle. He might be willing to work with you if you are committed to doing it yourself.

 

[jameslawson71]

Check the group buy in the group buy forum......


I have built several M14 type rifles and my best advise would be that if you don't have a M14 smith who will allow you to look over his shoulder while barreling and headspacing and allowing you to ask questions and then watch you while you do the first one, get someone reputable to do it for you. Close enough just doesn't get it. Nothing like wondering if you have done a safe build.GI8GI8GI8

Building one from scratch can be very rewarding in the self-satisfaction department, but save yourself some worry and have one of our M14 Armorers do that part. Assembling the small parts can be just as much fun.

Agree with Hawk. If you can watch someone, who knows what they are doing in regards to installing a barrel and all things associated with that, then I would recommend against it as well. McKee and Kulek's book is very good, but you have to work with the receiver and barrel and bolt "you" have, not the one that was used in the lengthy and critical barrel installation and timing chapters. The person, whose shoulder you are going to look over, should have done this many times before, and is also a machinist who can perform things like peening-over or lathing the barrel shoulder if required.

I had McKee & Kuleks book for about 3 years before I took the plunge to install my first barrel, but the first time, I still asked someone who knows how to do this let me watch and show me some things.

If you do do it, I recommend a pull through reamer as opposed to the method in Mckee's book. Its too easy to blow it "big time" trying to keep track of the headspace numbers as you progress. Its too subjective for a beginner. May need to with the Krieger depending on how it times on your LRB.

 

[82nd ABN]

I did it and it's not rocket science. The key is to have the right tools for the job and I'm not talking home made fixes for the tools either. I am not talking about those of you who have Mede there own barrel vices and ot receiver wrenches . All the right tools will cost you at retail pricing about 1000-1500 depending on how many of certian items you buy. I posted a tool list in the past I'm not sure if it is still a good post or not. The key to getting your barrel timed right is patience in the set up. I use the badger timing guages a digital angle finder and the brownells action wrench and barrel vice. I can tell you this about your choice of receiver and barrel. Thy are top notch choices. One thing you have to consider is your barrel is not going to hand index propperly. Krieger purposely builds there barrels with a 20-22 degree index rather than a 16-18 degree nominal index. What does that mean to you and me? Well you are going to have to have a machinist cut the shoulder to custom fit the barrel to the receiver to index properly. There are no two ways around it. No in the past I thought of having Krieger build one with the 16-18 degree indexing but what happens if you are too short and the barrel is already indexing by hand at 6oclock? You can't add material to the barrel shoulder. So that will be your first hurdle. After that everything else is down hill. Be advised!!!!! You are going to need to modify you action wrench to fit the m25 receiver!!!!!! Big time important. I just did one. It's not hard to do if, again you have the right tools. I ammworking in a build right now I would like to make a tutorial but I always get to building rather than writing and taking pictures as I go along. It's not hard to build one and I say if your willing to risk the parts go for it. I did have a reputable M14 smith looking over my shoulder for the first one but once you know how the rest are like being on autopilot.