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This will probably cause a problem, but in regards to Bedding, "Tighter is not always better", nor is "Harder Bedding material better".. I am not trying to change anybody's mind, if you feel or think both these assertions are incorrect that's OK with me.

Bedding any rifle, {all most, improves the potential accuracy. Incorrect bedding can also decrease accuracy. Excellent bedding methods using the incorrect bedding material can cause erratic performance, the most troublesome being change of Zeros.

A case in point recently experienced doing a bedding job. For many years Marine Tex was my choice of bedding material. At that time the routing procedure {procedures were defined.. This was before the Fiberglass stocks became popular, most stocks were USGI, Walnut... When the larger wood stocks became available the routing procedures were changed. More extensive routing was done on these larger wood stocks, this required as much as twice the bedding compound to be used. The problem came about because Marine Tex working time is somewhat short to apply to this increased routing. This caused a rushed time frame, many bedding jobs had to be repeated.

The Bedding issue was resolved when J B Weld replaced the Marine Tex, J B ... J B Weld offers a longer working time, this prevents redoing the entire job. J B Weld, in my opinion, is not as hard as Marine Tex, this caused some concern at first. The remarkable outcome of this material change was the Rifles shot just as well, in some cases better the those bedded with the harder materials.

Good bedding jobs can be done using an assortment of materials, the results depend on the skill and knowledge of the person doing the work, no surprise there. J B Weld can also be used to fill in bedding voids successfully, this was not the case with Marine Tex or Bisonite, that was also my personal experience.

Considering the cost of some popular bedding materials VS the value is questionable.
\
Best to all,,, Art
 

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This will probably cause a problem, but in regards to Bedding, "Tighter is not always better", nor is "Harder Bedding material better"
...
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Could you elaborate on your views about this?

Why is "tighter not better", unless of course it is done wrong.
And why is "harder not better", unless it is not as durable, or has excessive shrinkage, etc.

I've only worked on my own rifle and my choice was to use an epoxy that has a fairly long 'working time', and was not 'runny' - so it stayed where I wanted it, and was easy to clean-up.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA
 

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I've used Bisonite steel bed in all types of stocks for over 30 years without problems. It's a little harder to work with in getting the consistency just right (until you get used to it), but it has adequate working time. It was the standard at the AMU.
 

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Art,I had one of your rifles for awhile. It was use to learn from since guys a few and far between to work on these this any more. I also bought your DVD on bedding to learn from. WHAT A GREAT RESOURCE&THANKS. I had a USGI stock bed up for myself because I didn't want to wait 3 months. In fact it was a fiberglass stock I was putting a rear lug into. It worked fine and since then I have 3-4 more. My personal LRB M25 relug is done that way.
Pfc out
 

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Good to hear of your approval if jb weld. I bedded my receiver with jb weld recently. It was my first time bedding and if there's one thing I learned, it's to let the jb weld sit for a bit until it's more viscous. I made quite the mess while flopping the stuff into my stock...
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
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Could you elaborate on your views about this?

Why is "tighter not better", unless of course it is done wrong.
And why is "harder not better", unless it is not as durable, or has excessive shrinkage, etc.

I've only worked on my own rifle and my choice was to use an epoxy that has a fairly long 'working time', and was not 'runny' - so it stayed where I wanted it, and was easy to clean-up.

Jay Kosta
Endwell NY USA


Let me address harder first. The hard compounds can and do develop cracks, it is not uncommon to experience chunks falling out of the bedded area. Not all cracks are easy to see even when looking for them. Tighter bedding jobs are excellent if all else is in near perfect alignment, which seldom is the case. Slight misalignment in a hard tight bedded receiver is
" un -forgiving", resulting in a less than Match quality rifle, the same misalignment in a softer bedding material will out perform the first example, granted, both cases are not what we want, between the two examples I'll take the second.

Every Match conditioned M1A has a high risk of an issue, there are a few perfect ones.. Today with all the Commercial items on the market there is a noticeable "Spec Stacking". Some of the issues can be overcome, to a higher degree, using a softer compound in I my experiences.


Bisonite is a super compound to use as bedding, it would be my second choice, it would be my first choice if there were all USGI parts available..
 

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This will probably cause a problem, but in regards to Bedding, "Tighter is not always better", nor is "Harder Bedding material better".. I am not trying to change anybody's mind, if you feel or think both these assertions are incorrect that's OK with me.

Bedding any rifle, {all most, improves the potential accuracy. Incorrect bedding can also decrease accuracy. Excellent bedding methods using the incorrect bedding material can cause erratic performance, the most troublesome being change of Zeros.

A case in point recently experienced doing a bedding job. For many years Marine Tex was my choice of bedding material. At that time the routing procedure {procedures were defined.. This was before the Fiberglass stocks became popular, most stocks were USGI, Walnut... When the larger wood stocks became available the routing procedures were changed. More extensive routing was done on these larger wood stocks, this required as much as twice the bedding compound to be used. The problem came about because Marine Tex working time is somewhat short to apply to this increased routing. This caused a rushed time frame, many bedding jobs had to be repeated.

The Bedding issue was resolved when J B Weld replaced the Marine Tex, J B ... J B Weld offers a longer working time, this prevents redoing the entire job. J B Weld, in my opinion, is not as hard as Marine Tex, this caused some concern at first. The remarkable outcome of this material change was the Rifles shot just as well, in some cases better the those bedded with the harder materials.

Good bedding jobs can be done using an assortment of materials, the results depend on the skill and knowledge of the person doing the work, no surprise there. J B Weld can also be used to fill in bedding voids successfully, this was not the case with Marine Tex or Bisonite, that was also my personal experience.

Considering the cost of some popular bedding materials VS the value is questionable.
\
Best to all,,, Art
Let me address harder first. The hard compounds can and do develop cracks, it is not uncommon to experience chunks falling out of the bedded area. Not all cracks are easy to see even when looking for them. Tighter bedding jobs are excellent if all else is in near perfect alignment, which seldom is the case. Slight misalignment in a hard tight bedded receiver is
" un -forgiving", resulting in a less than Match quality rifle, the same misalignment in a softer bedding material will out perform the first example, granted, both cases are not what we want, between the two examples I'll take the second.

Every Match conditioned M1A has a high risk of an issue, there are a few perfect ones.. Today with all the Commercial items on the market there is a noticeable "Spec Stacking". Some of the issues can be overcome, to a higher degree, using a softer compound in I my experiences.


Bisonite is a super compound to use as bedding, it would be my second choice, it would be my first choice if there were all USGI parts available..

Art, I was talking too Nez on the phone, oh some time back not that long ago and the subject of bedding comes up. Well Nez tells me about this New Anti Rotational Torque Bedding method you have perfected. Seems that Nez is convinced the rifle and bullet now drive themself down range and hit the X all on there own, the shooter is just along for the ride?

Now Art you wouldn't think Nez would be pulling my leg now would he?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Art, I was talking too Nez on the phone, oh some time back not that long ago and the subject of bedding comes up. Well Nez tells me about this New Anti Rotational Torque Bedding method you have perfected. Seems that Nez is convinced the rifle and bullet now drive themself down range and hit the X all on there own, the shooter is just along for the ride?

Now Art you wouldn't think Nez would be pulling my leg now would he?

Hello Phil,

Nez has been in Texas for some time, perhaps a little has rubbed off..
He is a Hardholder of the first order, super person...

Good to hear from you... Art
 

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I have had good luck with acra glas and heavy floc. Ive learned it ya really put the fiber to it it doesnt seem to crack and chipmas much. Might do an m1 this winter for a freind in jb weld and see how that goes
 

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Thanks Art. I used Marine-Tex last time I bedded and I've got the best results out of that bedding job, so far. I've known for some time that you like JB Weld so I used it to bed my Savage 110 a couple of years ago. The results were very good.

Thanks again for sharing. We love learning.

Tony.
 

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I love JB Weld for situation I want something to self level or flow out with no air holes or voids. Filling in the selector cut out is simple by damming up both sides and pour in the JB Weld. I used it in recoil lug areas on some bolt rifles where I could control the flow. If you miss containing the JB Weld you quickly find your leak.

I have been using Devcon products in pouring fixtures for tooling nests and the Steel Putty for my rifle work. If you do not whip it up it mixes well without air bubbles and stays where you apply it.
 

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i might try it one day. i have a question
what are the good products to use for release on parts.
what kind and how thick so as not to glue action and stock together?
thank you Lruss
 

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i might try it one day. i have a question
what are the good products to use for release on parts.
what kind and how thick so as not to glue action and stock together?
thank you Lruss
I use Valspar 225. Valspar no longer makes it though, and the formula went to Lily-Ram. It's now called Lily-Ram 225. It's expensive, but thin and it works very well. I've used it to bed a few rifles. I bought two cans and after the shipping and haz-mat, I paid $75.

You can get it at sherfab. http://www.sherfab.com/
 

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Art, I was talking too Nez on the phone, oh some time back not that long ago and the subject of bedding comes up. Well Nez tells me about this New Anti Rotational Torque Bedding method you have perfected. Seems that Nez is convinced the rifle and bullet now drive themself down range and hit the X all on there own, the shooter is just along for the ride?

Now Art you wouldn't think Nez would be pulling my leg now would he?
i have seen groups on targets posted here, and Nez appears in ghe TSRA newsletter with mentions http://i1220.photobucket.com/albums...6E8DEA-930-000003EFEAEEDC5B_zpsd118deb4.jpgof his wins, so you might believe it! I hope to make it to a match in the hill country and meet him,and Art.
 
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