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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Anybody have one at the house, if there is one first aid piece of equipment you have, this would probably be it. A shock early saves lives. Many of us will eventually need this. Units run 800.00 to 1600.00 , 500.00 - 800.00 used/refurbished. Any thoughts ?
 

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A shock early saves lives---you are correct---sort of, but unless you have the definitive, skilled care afterwords, it is all for nothing. Heart attack, electrocution, drowning, trauma, etc will all require significant "after-shock" interventions; which most do not have the training, equipment, medication or facilities to offer. Point being---simple defibrillation is not enough.

My 2cw----use that money on something you know your going to use or need---i.e. generators, water filtration system, food, ammo, shelter, gas etc.
 

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I have to agree with Rwilli. There would be so many preps that I would place ahead of this one that would be much more useful and practical IMHO. From what little that I understand of an AED, it is only useful in certain, specific conditions and it will not shock unless those conditions are met.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
A shock early saves lives---you are correct---sort of, but unless you have the definitive, skilled care afterwords, it is all for nothing. Heart attack, electrocution, drowning, trauma, etc will all require significant "after-shock" interventions; which most do not have the training, equipment, medication or facilities to offer. Point being---simple defibrillation is
I think you'll find the upcoming guidelines will not include any drug use during resuscitation except for specific circumstances. Having said that , you are correct that you may need anti arrhythmic drugs and other care afterwards. But enough of us will die at home, and these machines are almost idiot proof. Even if not in a SHTF situation. If it's you or your wife at home that goes down than the S&@# Has Hit The Fan. Be it pre disaster or post.

But to you point other preps should be in order before this. But this will save a life more than an Ace Wrap.
 

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Chances are if you need one, you won't survive long without sufficient post-care. There simply are more cost effective preps out there.

If you're giving CPR anyway, a precordial thump is the poor mans options. It may work, it may not (seen it work once on a patient who lived, once on one who died a few days later, and do nothing about 2 dozen times). Something is better than nothing I suppose.

But just remember, trauma dead is dead.
 

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We get trained on them at work but I have not had to use one. Not sure if it is standard, but our units talk you through what to do. No paper instructions that could get lost or whatever.

Not sure which specific model it is, but I can look that up when I get back to work in a few days.
 

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We have the same units Thor. Inclined to agree with everybody. It's a good idea, but very far down the list for me, to many other purchases/training to be high up on the list.
 

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An AED is good for one thing-shocking someone back into a viable heart rhythm from a lethal one. To sustain the viable rhythm you would have to have a plethora of different cardiac meds at your disposal, along with the ACLS protocol for administration of those drugs. The wrong dose or wrong drug after defibrillation could be lethal as well. As for shelf-life, the meds will expire long before the pads or batteries will.
Without the drugs, may as well leave the AED on the wall, unless, of course, you have an ambulance on the way, or you bug out to a hospital. (Now there's a thought!) Aftercare for the patient is as important as the defibrillation, requiring skilled interventions, and even then, outcomes are somewhat unpredictable. Many of post-arrest patients never recover.
 

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The necessity of very fresh batteries has become an issue. We're now replacing annually. There's some liability avoidance in that frequency but there was truth to not getting full performance from batteries that had been on standby awhile.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I'm sorry to belabor the point , the re- establishment of a heart rhythm via defibrillation is the ONLY way one survives cardiac death due to dysrhythmia. ACLS standards coming out next year will not include administering drugs, It's CPR till defibrillation becomes available , then treat the 5 T's and 5 H' s.

Toxin Hypoxia
Tamponade. Hypovolemia ( blood volume loss )
Tension pneumothorax. Hypo/hyperkalemia ( low or high potassium)
Thrombus ( blood clot ) cardiac - MI. Hypothermia
Thrombus Pulmonary Hydrogen ion. (Acidosis)Military Tactical Gear


Guide lines are changing because of the AED availability now and improvement in survival rates of out of hospital fatal arrhythmias treated with early defibrillation before advanced medical care arrives.

But to the majority consensus, they will be battery dependent, they are expensive. And for a SHTF prep this should fall after antibiotics and anticoagulants. The only thing I would say are these can be used by ANYBODY Just turn it on and it tells you what to do. No advanced medical training needed.

Thanks for the input have been debating on weather to get one myself.
I am a RN but I see the benefit of citizen ownership of these units. And anyone trying to trade medical training for a SHTF sanctuary this could go a long way
 

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It has been said but i want to make a short post saying this.



There is a misconception that a defib unit "shocks a heart back to life"

Like on tv they grab the paddles when there is a flat line. This is false. Shocking a non beating heart is like turning on a pool pump without priming it.
You need chest compression for flatline defib for the various out of synch heart rythyms.

Get training or die. That defib unit would be great but they are for old people or people with heart trouble.
 

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Also chest compressions are hard to perform you gotta rotate. I have seen burly types run out of steam and that was only a simulation.


I reccomend if your elderly female family members do not have a DNR to discuss it.


Chest compression on old ladies usually crush their ribs. Noon wants to live like that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
You do not shock a " heart back to life " you shock a fatal arrhythmia into a viable heart rhythm. Shockable rhythms are ventricular fibrillation and pulse less ventricular tachycardia present in 85% of sudden death cases from the causes of the 5 T's and 5 h's as previously posted.
 

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The units we have at work that talk you through all the steps are Heartstart Defibrillator by Philps. Not sure what they cost, but it's a neat set up.
 

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You do not shock a " heart back to life " you shock a fatal arrhythmia into a viable heart rhythm. Shockable rhythms are ventricular fibrillation and pulse less ventricular tachycardia present in 85% of sudden death cases from the causes of the 5 T's and 5 h's as previously posted.
Are you ems?
 
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