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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
CNBC story says that the WHO has come to the conclusion that asymptomatic carriers are not spreading the virus. What's really interesting to me is this statement from the WHO doctor;

“From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, head of WHO’s emerging diseases and zoonosis unit, said at a news briefing from the United Nations agency’s Geneva headquarters. “It’s very rare.”
My emphasis.

If "it still seems" to be rare doesn't that mean that they've known that it was rare for some time? If that's so then why has the CDC (since April) told everybody that we needed to wear masks because asymptomatic people were causing a major increase in the spread of the virus?

Seems like somebody is lying to us.
 

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I am not shocked.

I have decided to 'know' nothing for certain, but to simply weigh possibilities and likelihoods and act accordingly based on my best guess.

That of which I am certain, is that whoever is filtering information between the REAL experts in the field, and the public space, has only earned my distrust and in some cases, contempt.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Get the so called "news" services to print and broadcast the hoax.
 

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This is not surprising and it's quite a coincidence this is being brought to light considering most stay at home orders and lockdowns have been lifted. We also weren't wearing masks for most of the "peak". I remember being in grocery stores with a lot of people and nobody had a mask on during March and most of April.

I suspect these so called experts have seen what kind of effects their doomsday predictions have had on the world and are in damage control mode.

Of course I could be just as wrong as the experts were in their virus assumptions
 

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The WHO and CDC have both made huge assumptions based on very faulty mathematical models.

The problem with these models, as any statistical model, is the selection of correct data. In an era where communications should be accurate and timely, we seem to be no better off than during the Great Pandemic of 1918.

The health organizations are in too much hurry to get out information to the public, lest they be thought of as incompetent. Well, incompetence works both ways, and these folks are the worst. The data have also been politicized, worsening the problem.

We have a virus, which can travel at turnpike speeds on the ground, and jet aircraft speeds in the air. By the time bureaucracies react, they're already days behind the spread. Viruses don't spread in a linear fashion; more like a pebble's wake when dropped into a stream. Yes, the wake spreads out in a circle, but also wherever it's taken by the current.

Added to the movement, is the accidental or intentional omission of critical data, and it becomes impossible to forecast a virus' movements. China withheld the virus' genome mapping solution for six days from the world, enough time to spread the virus around the world several times.

The WHO and CDC pooh-poohed the doctors on the ground who dared disagree with their forecasts. The two doctors in California were excoriated, as were UC Davis and Stanford, when they stated the exposure rate was 40-50 times the death rate. Now, the CDC and WHO have finally come around.

The faulty data and conclusions remind me of the "scientists" who use models to predict climate change and global warming.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
...The faulty data and conclusions remind me of the "scientists" who use models to predict climate change and global warming.
I agree, that's why it looked like this at my house this morning.
 

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The only reason I wear a mask is there are sick inconsiderate aZZholes that are still coming out in public and to my store that are coughing in line and some then coughing in our face at the cash register like we just have to tolerate it, While we can kick them out, it doesn't seem to sink in to these idiots that there are other people that matter besides them and they are the problem, and they will just do it somewhere else, to someone else. I wasn't so worried about asymptomatic carriers, just the ones that are freshly infected and coming out in public anyway.
m14brian
 

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Nice to know those who aren't sick aren't making everyone else sick. Just like the old days. Whodathunkit?
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Well I guess everyone has to do what they feel comfortable with but personally I don't think a mask does squat for keeping you from getting infected. If your mask doesn't fit tightly around your nose and mouth then you're still breathing in any virus that might be on water droplets. If you think that somebody will spit down your throat, sneeze, or cough directly in your mouth or your face then I could see wearing a mask but I work in a store too and so far I haven't had that happen to me or the people that I work with. If you live in a place where they do those things then I suspect that you have a lot more to worry about than just getting sick. According to the latest CDC information the probability of anybody dying is extremely small - about 0.2% to 0.4% so I'm not all that worried about it anyways.

More info from the WHO on 5 June

WHO officials reminded the public that masks still must be worn correctly, cared for and kept clean to ensure that they are effective. "People can infect themselves if they use contaminated hands to adjust a mask or repeatedly take it on or off," explained the Director-General.

"I cannot say this clearly enough," said the Director-General. "Masks alone will not protect you from COVID-19."
They also recommended that you need at least three layers of material in the mask to be effective and if you don't wash your hands before you touch the mask you will risk infecting yourself. They also say that you can't touch your eyes or face if you touch the outside of your mask. So the truth is that a mask isn't of much value for most people because they aren't taking care to not do the other things that could infect them.

Unless you are caring for people who have been diagnosed with the virus a mask isn't of much value. If you think you need to wear a mask at least wear one that fits properly and follow all of the other precautions that are recommended, that way you wont be wasting your time and you can rest easy knowing that you aren't being manipulated by the virtue signalers.
 

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I wasn't so worried about asymptomatic carriers, just the ones that are freshly infected and coming out in public anyway.
m14brian
Apart from the COVID, it's nicer not to have gross people breathing directly on you, or stuff that you or somebody else will be touching, regardless. If I were dictator, I'd have a team following me around dispatching masks to random people who just look sick, one way or another. Sometimes I'm at a grocery store, and somebody's kid is grabbing stuff, and their parent [email protected]$$edly tells them to stop, and they do it again, and they do it again. If I wasn't so polite, I might yell, "TAPE YOUR KID's HANDS TO THEIR FACE OR I'M GOING TO DO IT FOR YOU!" Once a friend's kid didn't like when I told him no to more sugar, and he went off and slapped me in the face. I hog tied him with athletic tape, and left him on the ground, under direct supervision, while we waited for his parents to return. Hey, I can dream of going big. But some people mistake discipline as abuse. I wasn't angry. I thought it was funny as heck. He was pretty angry, though he's probably over it by now.

GI1
 

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RAMMAC, It probably doesn't do a lot as you have articulated, I figured it might help with droplets. The way the sun comes in I could see some people spitting a little during speaking against the sunlight, it was gross.

You are also right, we have a lot more to deal with, there was mob mentality when mask wearing was required by the county and worse when it was lifted but still required by the company. Violence at some locations. We didn't get any of that, several of us at my location have authoritative voices and show they are in control. I also carry a huge fixed blade knife very conspicuously on my belt on the clock and they see it and altogether it seems to make them think twice before doing something stupid. But the mentality for temptation to try something and running their mouth with threats as they walked out is there. Very sad it had to be that way.
m14brian
 

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The only reason I wear a mask is there are sick inconsiderate aZZholes that are still coming out in public and to my store that are coughing in line and some then coughing in our face at the cash register like we just have to tolerate it, While we can kick them out, it doesn't seem to sink in to these idiots that there are other people that matter besides them and they are the problem, and they will just do it somewhere else, to someone else. I wasn't so worried about asymptomatic carriers, just the ones that are freshly infected and coming out in public anyway.
m14brian
Ah yes, the mouth breathers. The knuckle draggers. Its very interesting observing them in their natural habitat at Walmart. I think they were featured on Mutual of Omahas Wild Kingdom when I was a boy.
 

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Wearing a mask to stop this virus

The only reason I wear a mask is there are sick inconsiderate aZZholes that are still coming out in public and to my store that are coughing in line and some then coughing in our face at the cash register like we just have to tolerate it, While we can kick them out, it doesn't seem to sink in to these idiots that there are other people that matter besides them and they are the problem, and they will just do it somewhere else, to someone else. I wasn't so worried about asymptomatic carriers, just the ones that are freshly infected and coming out in public anyway.
m14brian
Is like putting up a cyclone fence to stop mosquitoes.
 

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"If "it still seems" to be rare doesn't that mean that they've known that it was rare for some time? If that's so then why has the CDC (since April) told everybody that we needed to wear masks because asymptomatic people were causing a major increase in the spread of the virus?

Seems like somebody is lying to us."

I do not want to be the one to take up for a communist at the WHO but it doesn't have to be a lie. They don't know. "Seems" is not knowing. Doctors and public health officials have a professional responsibility to at least try to protect people. There is no question that the disease is real and potentially a catastrophe. True enough I do not know anyone who has gotten seriously ill. That doesn't take away the potential harm. Can't they just err on the side of caution?

Years ago I knew a lawyer who would say, when reading about a surgeon sawing off the wrong leg or some other obvious blunder, "you have to remember he was just practicing." Give them a break, they're only practicing.
 
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