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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
got my socom back from phil arrington awhile back. we basically added or modified everything and anything with sadlak parts or USGI national match parts. a nice sum of moola to do the hoola was involved. he went out and sighted it. we both wear glasses at our advanced ages and the 1st thing that caught his eye since this was his 1st socom build was the obvious rear ghost ring, and the fat front tritium sight, which wasnt quite up to brightness. i got it back from him, stuffed it in my darkened closet, and noticed the tritium kind of seemed to be very dull.

time marches on, life gets in the way, that job thing gets in the way.

fast forward, my younger son buys a brand new "loaded" stainless on my advice. so we are back in M1-A "build mode".

after tearing his apart and taking all of my leftover "super duper" match parts and putting them on his, after arrington and i "uberized" my super match with every goodie known to man, i kind of drifted back to the SOCOM. went into a darkened room(scarey) and looked thru my ghost ring site, and basically concluded the tritium had leaked out causing a superfund haz mat site, or it just gave up the ghost. so i called SA! and they said to send the entire rifle back. i kind of questioned this(why send the entire rifle?) and slept on it. next day(sat) printed off my SA RGA form for fed ex, and decided to scribe lines where phil had set front site. took sight off and shipped it off to SA for warranty replacement. pretty cool of them.


anyway my questions on this SOCOM:

1) how long does the tritium last? trijicon says 7 years for their hand gun sights. anyone know about these SOCOM front sights? and how long they will last?

2) phil mentioned possibly going to a national match rear peep sight, replacing the rear ghost ring, to gain some downrange accuracy. what size should i try? i do want to keep the fat front tritium sight on the SOCOM for low light close in zombee invasions. i have the "uberized" super duper match for long long range zombee invasions, and now have the "loaded" M1-A for mid range zombee invasions.

3) is there a combo flash suppressor/compensator/muzzle brake that is worth installing on this SOCOM? kind of liked the TROY version. it seemed like it did it all. accepts USGI sound suppressor, was a flash hider, and a muzzle brake. or at least they claim that. any feed back on them?


thanks for any input/feedback.


yep with (3) freeking M1-A's in the family, you get damn good at tearing them apart and cleaning them. and dreaming about "MO" better-er parts!
 

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I would have insisted in only taking off the front sight and shipping it. Hopefully it comes back with all your original parts, they're kind of known for just replacing things at will that they think are "bad". If they refused I'd have contacted XS Sights and have them handle it.

1) Tritium has a half life of 7 years. So at 7 years it'll be about half as bright as when it was new. 7 years after that it'll be on it's way out. Sounds like you got a bad vial, it happens.

2) You may want to run a standard GI rear aperture rather than a NM unit. The fight is going to be that fat front sight when it comes to accuracy. I prefer the tritium bar front sight since it's about the same width as a USGI standard front sight and pair it with a 595 NM rear aperture.

3) I ran the Troy for a while on my 18.5" setup, it was okay, I would be hesitant to put one on a Socom though. Reason is it attaches directly to the barrel so you lose the GLFS completely. No front sight and no spacer for the gas plug. Both of those are unacceptable to me. Instead you may want to look into an SEI Socom GLFS with 5/8X24 threaded end and possibly a PWS compensator (combo brake and suppressor). Nokick.com sells a kit with all that in it. Next issue you'll run into if you go this route, the SEI GLFS sight base is raised so you'll need a standard height front sight... For tritium sights XS and SEI have the dot style available and SEI has the bar style available, all in standard height, nokick.com sells both SEI units if you like one stop shopping.

You'll have to decide what's right for you. Personally I won't give up my front sight (even though I rarely use it). That means I'd go the SEI Socom GLFS and PWS setup with a tritium bar or dot and I'd add the SEI Socom plug just cause I could.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
hey thank you very much for the info. dont post much here, as i kind of live in the vortex of smith ent/arrington/and mcmillian and know all of them personally thru aerospace machine tool sales for their mills/lathes.

but when i ask a question here i sure as hell get a good answer each and everytime. thats what makes this site a great one. btwn "dee" at sadlak, bill ricca, and others here, all of my questions have been answered truthfully with not a hell of alot of bias or snobb-ish-ness.

my socom has already got a knotch in its stock! (1) cow elk here so far. my basic premise on a running shot(which this was) downhill into a canyon towards me, was to fill the ghost ring with FUR and FIRE! and it worked just as advertised with fed 168gr BTHP's. (1) very dead elk.

as far as the front sight and rear sight and suppressor/flash hider, i think i will go your route and try the changeover to the rear sight .595 NM that arrington has laying around and see how that works.

im no spring chicken and have been doing this awhile now and have learned to explore all options before changing angles of the dangles. as we all(most of us) know that changing (1) thang, sometimes leads down some pretty ugly expensive paths and ya end up back at square one.

i am going for my class III and on my list,starting with suppressors is a .22 can,a .45 can, and a .30 cal can. so i was liking the idea of the troy model and it being a somewhat easy match up with a can. but hey ya cant have it all sometimes without alot of headaches.


heres some pics of the family:


on the super duper match, phi arrington got rid of the SA scope mt and replaced with an ARMS picatinny rail, and an ARMS pair of QR(quick release) rings for the scope. takes me about 2 seconds to place on or 2 seconds to remove. and it retains ZERO dead nutz. very happy with this reasonably priced change over. the antiquated SA mount will now go on my sons "loaded" version when he gets bucks up for a scope.
 

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Definitely some nice looking rifles.

Something you can keep in mind... If you run the SEI Socom plug with their Socom GLFS you can also run their Vortex which accepts a USGI can with the above setup. Just something to think about. You'll have to plan for it by installing the appropriate muzzle device of course but it's an option.

On my setup I opted for a SureFire brake figuring once I'm out of CA I can get a can for it. A brake for regular shooting and the can for flash and sound suppression, win win in my book since if I want one I'll probably want the other.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
the neat thing about cans...............ya dont piss anyone off!


was introduced to them years ago, machined them here, for various mfg's, or their mts,etc. but my younger son and i did combat wombat pistol at usery pass,az. my ffl guy had one on his ruger. he let us use it on our built to the hilt 22/45. what a hoot that was! had used one of my friends on a old old old ruger .22 and that was a long time ago. lots of quiet fun.


figure as i said when i can get the cash i will do a .22, a 9mm, a .45, and a .30 can. before they make each stamp a $10K bill!


will go over to smith and talk with them about this front end on the socom. for the while i am happy with all of them, as they sit. it took awhile, we made some mistakes, and we corrected them. and they are all shooters.

today we are gonna blast the "loaded" and just get a good solid 100yd zero for the kid. after that................hes on his own like i was wayyyy before the internet. and back then it was a learning curve. he already wants to get a scope and i flat out put my foot down and stated "learn the freeking iron sights ya moron!" "for without a damn good understanding of the irons:...........you are worthless!" hahahaha LOL! the TRUTH HURTS!
 

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I personally don't feel the NEW sights on a Socom are very bright. I usually need to be in the dark for several minutes until I can see the post. However, light is more important to me than the tritium insert(no, I don't want to discuss the merits or lack of a mounted light on the rifle,I think it's important)so after finding the Streamlight SuperTac I'm happy. You'll light a target in excess of 200 yards like daylight with this light and then you CAN USE that big fat front sight and Ghost Ring rear.
 

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While tritium has several different experimentally determined values of its half-life, the National Institute of Standards and Technology lists 4,500±8 days (approximately 12.32 years).

My SAI .45 has Novak Tritium front and rear sights and after 10 years they are just starting to mellow enough to be really comfortable.
 

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While tritium has several different experimentally determined values of its half-life, the National Institute of Standards and Technology lists 4,500±8 days (approximately 12.32 years).

My SAI .45 has Novak Tritium front and rear sights and after 10 years they are just starting to mellow enough to be really comfortable.
and now we se where you came up with geeckMCORPS1

i had a set on a 1992 issued yugoslavian AK47 that were 10 old years and they showed up very bright
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
i have NOTHING TO SAY BUT GOOD ABOUT SA 's customer service. i really didnt think they would send me a new front sight,let alone listen to me about the front sight and how it was noticed by others,then myself. i never whacked it, poured any nasty bore cleaner on it, it just kind of fell apart.and was very dull.


also on this same SOCOM awhile back i noticed some hairline cracks on the stock and SA said send it back. what color would you like? and I SAID "GREEN" because we are "GREEN " kind of guys. as in CAMO HUNTING GREEN kind of guys. so yeah SA's customer service is NUMBA 1 ! they have my biz for life. run a great operation and i have had nothing but FUN with all (3) of my M1-A's i have purchased from them..


yesterday with the brand new "loaded" model,we blasted 200 rds at 100yds lazer beamed(laser) off with a leupold range finder, 8 clicks up and it was DEAD NUTZ ACCURATE! very very VERY HAPPY with their products. that mean nasty evil milk jug NEVER HAD A CHANCE!

20-25 rd full mag dumps. over and over until ya couldnt even touch the handguard it was so damn HOT! and NEVER A WHIMPER!


we added my left over super match piston, left over super match op spring, left over super match op rod guide, USGI sling from bill ricca, some CMI mags, and it just went to town and did exactly what it was designed to do.


this "loaded" stainless barrel , black evil synthetic stock, IS A SHOOTER! man we had FUN! my buddy and his (2) kids ages 25 and 21 were DROOLING after dumping a 25rd mag each! I MEAN DROOLING BIG TIME!
 

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Tritium should last 10+ years. I just replaced a set meprolight night sights on my G22 that I purchased new in 1998. They still had some life left, but just opted for new non staked ones.
 

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you know i just picked up a socom16 and didnt even know it should have tritium sights.... guess i got a dud as well...
 

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I've not found the tritium front sight on the SOCOM to be of any use. If there is any light left (twilight), the sights are weak enough so as not to be seen. If it is dark enough to see the sight, they blind you to the target.

They don't work like pistol sights, which you can look over to see the target.

Anyway, I can see why you'd want what you paid for, but the feature is strictly for mall ninjas. I shoot better after dark with USGI sights than the XS tritiums, as I can see the target, and if my cheekweld is right, the sight/bore is where it needs to be anyway.
 

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Regarding tritium... while in Iraq during OIF-1, I happened onto an Iraqi artillery site DIEVIL and wound up with a pretty cool souvenier... an aiming stake night light. Picture a three inch flashlight reflector set into an aluminum housing with a regular screw hole on the bottom the size of a camera mounting hole. Now add a tritium light bulb inside the reflector. Very cool. That damn thing has been in my bathroom illuminating the way for nocturnal abulations for 7 years now, and either I'm getting owl eyes, or it hasn't gotten any dimmer.

The H3 on my Army-issue Hamilton wristwatch dated 1982 is another issue, though. Dead as The Duke.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
well some of us older "mall ninjas" that wear glasses, like the fact during night ops that a lil bead of trijicon happiness GLOWS ever so BRIGHTLY for our tired ol eyeballs when called to duty in the middle of the night for things that go bump in the dark.



and yes as i write, my rear goofier than hell , ghost ring mall ninja rear "ghost sight is being hand fitted to a .595 aperture, so we can pick up a lil downrange accuracy.



CCW carry guns all get night sights. bedroom guns get night sights and streamlight or HK UTL lights. and since the SOCOM pulls bedroom duty/bear duty/zombee duty, guarding the king el jefe grande(me) it also got a midwest industries picatinny rail on one side for a streamlight, which detaches for when im chasing zombeez thru the desert.


the difference from the weak tritium sight and what springfield sent me back under warranty...............well is like night/day difference. LOL!
 

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Alright, call me a Mall Ninja... I like my XS sights. I plan on slimming them down, but I'll keep them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
i plan on keeping my ghost ring..................if i am hunting elk/deer and i am wearing my black ninja uniform..............


IN A MALL! or going door to door in afghan or bagdad looking for elk/deer/zombeez/or pesky insurgents. LOL!
 

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If you re read my post you'll notice that I mentioned night sites on pistols, and that they work.

The problem, once again, is that when you look through an aperture, all you can see is that bright front site. It will blind you to your target. A .595 ap is going to make it worse.

I've used the socom w/ XS sites in low light situations from "just starting to get dark" to "I wish there was more moon out tonight". The tritium front sight is detrimental to shooting after dark, not a help. If you can't see your target, you can't hit it.

BTW, the SOCOM muzzle break isn't the best thing for low light shooting, either.

Run it in the dark and see if I'm lying to you about either point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
no i dont doubt you. thats why i posted re: SEI socom front end. dont need a freeking muzzle break! just want the flash "eliminator".


here its 1/2 hour before sunrise and 1/2 after sundown hunting. PERIOD! any of that crap shooting at dark will get you in serious trouble and rightfully so.

the last thing we need is bullets whizzing by at dark. that would seriously piss me off also. enough to go hunt down any/all gendarmes in my hunt unit and explain to them my predicament and watch them go have some real fun nailing poachers/drunks to the cross.


all i am looking for is a MULTI-TOOL!

i can hunt a decent distance deer/elk. if i do any kind of optic i would do a zeiss reflex red dot. why? light weight and ease of removal same as streamlight TLR-1.

i can hunt in the really thick stuff(very abundant here).

very solid platform for "zombeez/ET's/t-rex's/teradactyl's" invading my camp site at night in the middle of BFE!. hence the streamlight TLR-1.

and a very solid bedroom platform for badguys wanting to disturb wifey and my sleep stealing things or worse! hence the streamlight TLR-1


and best of all it will take any/ all and then more abuse on the front of my quad getting splattered in mud dust snow dirt rain sleet! and still keep firing when mr. BIG DADDY MONSTER/BUCK/BULL decides its time to go on my wall!
 
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