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"Death From Above"
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
So there have been a few of post in the last two weeks with members requesting confirmation that there firing pin bridges were buggered up. Seems as though it's the latest and greatest when it comes to issues with springfield armory rifles. Last month it was hammer hooks.
Well I think I remeber seeing this issue once before but it has been awhile. So I am opening up the newest chapter regarding the inferior commercial components SAI is using in there rifles. After seeing all the post I decided to inspect my bridge. I am happy to report my bridge is good to go. On the other hand I was extreamly disappointed to discover the back of my bolt looked like it was hit by a Mac truck. I called SAI and briefly spoke to customer service. I bet you can guess what they said, they want the rifle back. I'm not so sure I am going to send it at this point. I will call my dealer rep over there tomorrow and see what he has to say. I may just lap a gi bolt in myself, it all depends on the replacement bolt I find. I want to keep the headspace down around 1.630-1.631. So take a look for yourself. It seems as though it's a soft bolt! I have come to this conclusion because the only thing that part of the bolt comes into contact with is the hammer. It's the part of the bolt that initially resets the hammer. No marks on the bridge or on the back end of the receiver under the heal. I took pics of it next to a USGI NOS bolt I have for another build I'm working on. Feel free to tell me what you think.


 

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I beleive I replied to the first post regarding this subject and my opinion was that the bridge had been hit and damaged by the bolt. At least that's what it looked like to me. Your bolt looks like it has not been playing nice with the bridge. My SAI bolt and receiver seem to be getting along at this time but I will be keeping an eye on this situation. Once in a while when I slowly cycle the bolt I can feel a hit and even at times a hang up on the bridge area. Quality control seems to be an ongoing issue at SAI. I will say that I don't like just shooting a rifle right out of the box and SAI has provided me with hours of fun reworking and fine tuning my weapon.
 

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"Death From Above"
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Nah it's not the bridge. The bridge does not have a mark on it. Besides that part off the bolt never goes forward of the bridge. I observed the bolt traveling back and the area that is trashed contacts the hammer. It's the only thing it comes in contact with. First it starts to cam over and then the center rail of the bolt rides the u shape in the hammer. Before the hammer starts to reset the hammer and the part that banged up are at a 90 angle to each other. No doubt it gaetting damaged buy resetting the hammer. No doubt it's a heat treatment issue. I will let them work on it but if they don't have a gi bolt I'm sending one with the rifle. Since I purchased this rifle in 07 I have personally built five LRB's from the ground up. There is no way in haties I would ever buy anything but an LRB forged receiver and install a gi parts kit. Although I plan on buying an LRB bolt with my next LRB receiver. December can't get here soon enough.
 

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82nd, is it only the bolt that shows this excessive wear or does the hammer also have damage? The reason I say this is I had to replace my original hammer due to excessive wear from bolt to hammer contact. Like I said, my bolt was/is fine but my hammer appeared to be a little soft and was being dented or dug out by the bolt retraction. Looks like you have the reverse situation. After I replaced the trigger group with a Winchester group I had no further problems. Never thought about the hardening issue, my bad.
 

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"Death From Above"
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
No problem. Hammer is fine other than all the park is knocked off. It's a winy hammmer. It's amazing how distorted the bolt is and nothing else.
 

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I agree it appears to be a heat treat issue. and can see why they want the rifle back. Even if you deside to fix it yourself, I would send the bolt in to let them examine it.

While I am not an SAI hater at all, it is very disturbing seeing these issues continueing to pop up. Of the 3 SAI rifles I have had, only 1 had a very minor issue.
 

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"Death From Above"
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Where would I fing the lot number? Is it part of what is stanmped where a normal gi number is or is it one other numbers I see stamped on the bolt? I would be more than happy to provide you with that info. I just dont know which one it is.
 

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"Death From Above"
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Heat lot number is F00173. The rifle is an M21 SM from the custom shop made in 2007.
 

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I wonder if your head space has opened up...? If resetting the hammer caused that I can only imagine what a violent explosion and a few thousand psi has been doing to your lugs GI8

Glad you caught it now rather than when I got a text saying you're having your bolt removed from your frontal lobe.
 

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82nd, that'd be a SAI forged bolt. I don't think I'd send the rifle back if it's been custom-tuned. I'd get a USGI bolt and cross my fingers, but I'll bet you'd be OK on headspace. You know how to install a bolt. If SAI doesn't have any GI bolts maybe you can work something out on covering your cost in trade for return of the soft bolt. They don't want that one floating around.

Rawnerves, was that a SAI hammer (MIM)? A USGI hammer (undrilled) is usually one of the most durable parts on the firearm. No surprise your problem ended with the swap-out.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
Funny you should mention the headspace Josh, I did check it and it is still 1.631. It is the same as what is on the tag.
Feel sorry for SAI because I will raise holy hell to have the problems fixed. I say problems because I did not mention it in my original post but after stripping down the barrel last night I noticed some major pitting going on on the exterior of the barrel. I am not sure if you are all aware but SAI, at least this pertains to the Krieger barrels, gets them in the white. They sit around for god nows how long and when they need to be installed they parkerise them. I have had my hands on a hundred or so barrels direct from Krieger and the parkerising job SAI does on the barrel compared to what Krieger does is like night and day. This rifle has maybe 700 rounds through it and has never seen a rainy or misty day. It is clear the parkerising was done over the pitting. Rust is like cancer on a barrel as far as I am concerned. Once its rust its always rust.
I told the rep I wanted the barrel and bolt replaced and if they could not provide me with a GI bolt I would send them one. They will not send me a barrel and bolt because of liability reasons. SO I said thats fine but if the barrel is not index correctly, and I will check, its coming back again. Also if the headspace changes its coming back again. I will send it back and forth on there dime until its right. I have four NO ISSUE LRB rifles I build over the summer. The M21 has become somewhat of a closet queen to tell you the truth. So I am not concerned about not having the rifle available for use. I also mentioned how many people that have had hammer hooks breaking and firing pin bridge issues. I was on a fishing expedition looking for a reaction. You know what he said? Thats why we have a lifetime warranty on our products. I am done with SAI. I cannot in good conscious recommend them to anyone. I have heard and seen to many warranty issues. This is the second time mine is going back and this rifle came from the custom shop. Well I have to run now and strip my rifle of all the parts I don't want to loose in the transaction.
 

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The bolt in my rifle has some minor peening and burrs in exactly the same place as your bolt but nowhere nearly as bad. Actually mostly pretty big burrs. The hammers in both trigger groups I have used in the rifle (both SAI - one normal and one M25 adjustable) only show wear of the park on them where they contact the bolt. The heat lot number on the bolt is F00096 and the rifle was made in 03/04. The safety bridge looks untouched. My rifle only has between 500 and 1000 rounds through it.

BTW I recently got back a new gas piston and flash suppressor from SAI after I discovered that the original FS was bored off center and the gas piston had a solid tail section - it was never bored. The new parts look and seem to work fine. In fact with the properly manufacture piston in it the rifle doesn't seem to cycle as fast and the brass is coming out of the rifle in much better shape than before. The cases are much cleaner and they all fall in the same place now.

This morning I fixed the trigger group lock up issue I was having with the rifle too. Ever since I first got it I had to use a loop of clothes line rope with my foot to close the latch. I met someone at my local range who had two M1As and asked them how hard they were to latch up. They got a firm lockup with just some very firm hand pressure and the TGs seated fully in the receivers. The problem with my rifle was the TG bedding was done incorrectly at the factory so the trigger group wouldn't fully seat into the receiver. As a side benefit now all my magazines fit in the rifle firmly without any play but still go in and out easily. The too tight lock up was probably the reason my trigger pull was so high and kept changing all the time. It was probably being warped by the excessive lock up pressure.
 

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I think it's a case of out of spec trigger housings made by SAI. Changing out the trigger group solved the problem I had with my Scout. All trigger groups used from SAI to usgi seated properly in different usgi fiberglass stocks, but the one group in question simply positioned the hammer further forward to strike the lower bolt and firing pin first in that same manner. The bolt didn't matter to me and I tried the bad group in my Fullsize with it's bolt to see and it did impact it. I didn't change out any hammers so there's always a possibility with the problem group it could have been the hammer, but I don't think so. My other SAI group was fine too when used and didn't smash the bolt at all.


DI5
 

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bd111, yes that was a commercial SAI hammer that came with the loaded. Except for the soft hammer the trigger group felt really good. I switched the entire group out for a Winny.
 

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"Death From Above"
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I understand the parkerising wear is normal. Glad to hear you got your rifle up and running.
Good news is its all boxed up all that is left to do is write a letter.
Even more good news is I got a call fron John Hollinger today and WOA has finished my Match Service Rifle -15A2 and it will be here friday!FRG1 I fully expect the rifle to be fixed but I am not certian that it will be done with a bolt that wont have the same issue down the road. I guess i have to wait another 700 rounds to find that out or just sell it when it gets back and build another LRB with parts that I know will work.
 

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Maybe you will get lucky and the repair will be the final tweak and you will have bullet proof M1A. Its hard to sell rifles.GI2

Good luck with SAI
 
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