M14 Forum banner
1 - 18 of 18 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,912 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I came across this article and thought it was good advise. Yea, you can't carry on an intelligent conversation or debate with a dumb, brainwashed person very well, but we should try to not be a jerk in our attempt to change their opinion or educate them, it will only make them oppose you that much more.

Here is a link to the article....

http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/5-tips-winning-hearts-minds-anti-gunners/
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,481 Posts
As much as you just want to slap them, your right, it's best to put that feeling on the back burner. Now if logic and facts can win over their emotions , maybe we can win a few converts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: yoteman

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,585 Posts
Wars for hearts and minds do not work:

Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan all remind us that it is a flawed tactic.

Scorched earth is the only thing that works with a zealot. Most antigunners are either zealots or useful idiots neither are worth banging your head into the wall for.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
638 Posts
The anti gunners, are a lot like PETA, it's their way or the highway. They will not listen to facts. The news media, has the facts,
just listen to all the gun experts, they have on their staff. Just ask the anti gunners, ban all guns. THE POLICE WILL PROTECT US
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,346 Posts
Wars for hearts and minds do not work:

Vietnam, Iraq and Afghanistan all remind us that it is a flawed tactic.

Scorched earth is the only thing that works with a zealot. Most antigunners are either zealots or useful idiots neither are worth banging your head into the wall for.
Some people are vehemently anti-gun because they've come to emotionally hate guns. Some people think that semi-autos and standard cap mags shouldn't be readily available (or should require hoops) because they A) don't understand crime and B) don't understand guns.

There are a lot of low information voters out there who see body counts/statistics on the news and don't understand who is committing the crimes or what the crimes are being committed with, or why it is that background checks, AWBs, and mag cap limits are meaningless for law enforcement and detrimental to public safety.

Part of the problem is that the news is afraid to publish the fact that the firearms homicide victimization rate for non-latino whites is 1.5 per 100,000 and the firearms homicide victimization rate for non-latino blacks is 15 per 100,000, and HALF of all gun homicide victims were non-latino blacks aged 15-25.

Can't talk about that though, because that would be racist.


EDIT: The source is the CDC's homicide data.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
228 Posts
I don't run into too many totally antigun folk, I'd give them a short version and if they start being hard nosed I'd let them be. No sense wasting too much air on them, they're already wasting a lot as is.

The ones I do spend time are the unknowns, the not yet decided. They can be told/taught and can learn from the experience. Go slow and easy, don't start getting political on them or get in their face and at least most will consider what you say.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,935 Posts
This reminds me of the avatar of The Most Interesting Man In The World asking for an order of fries. You don't win the heart or mind(?) of a liberal unless you're a bigger, better liberal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
The best way I've found to overcome antis is to convince them to test their convictions by joining me at the range for an hour. I give them the full safety briefing and put a .22 pistol in their hand, then stand back and watch for the grins to kick in. I've converted every anti- I know to a pro- that way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
547 Posts
The best way I've found to overcome antis is to convince them to test their convictions by joining me at the range for an hour. I give them the full safety briefing and put a .22 pistol in their hand, then stand back and watch for the grins to kick in. I've converted every anti- I know to a pro- that way.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Then again, some people may not want to try out a .22 pistol or rifle and stick to whatever anti-gun belief they were indoctrinated with and stay narrow minded.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
I'm sure there are people out there like that, but I don't know any of them. That may have something to do with the fact that narrow-minded people who aren't willing to critically examine their beliefs aren't really worth knowing. =)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
406 Posts
I came across this article and thought it was good advise. Yea, you can't carry on an intelligent conversation or debate with a dumb, brainwashed person very well, but we should try to not be a jerk in our attempt to change their opinion or educate them, it will only make them oppose you that much more.

Here is a link to the article....

http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/5-tips-winning-hearts-minds-anti-gunners/
Authored by someone who has likely never engaged in a “debate” with a die hard anti, or possibly still maintains that if you just “explain” how you’re a good person and would never hurt anyone, they will come around or at least soften their approach. They won’t. I’ve lobbied at state and national levels, am a member of several pro-gun groups, been to numerous rallies for and against, been to protests, partisan events, and a lot more.

My wife has a friend who is card carrying statist who truly believes that only the police should have guns, never met a tax she didn’t like, etc. These women have nothing in common, I don’t know why they’re friends but at one point she asked my wife how she felt about me teaching people how to murder other people because I taught firearms classes. That did it for the wife and she let this woman have it (metaphorically) with both barrels. This kind of crazy isn’t something you can bargain, reason or negotiate with.

This isn’t uncommon. When Anti-gunners got bussed into the Virginia General Assembly, the pro-gunners had pro-gun signs made up and as soon as the cameras rolled, all the pro-gunners put up their signs. The result: about 400+ pro gun signs, 3 or 4 anti-gun signs. All the camera shots from that year show enormous pro-gun forces. But the antis who organized the event were infuriated and went to the capitol police accusing people of threatening them.
Fortunately, there were numerous pro-gun videos disproving this lie.


These people make names for themselves by emoting for public effect to a degree that I’d venture to say everyone here would be uncomfortable with. They are fire and brimstone types, light on facts and while facts might be our friends, not in a debate with an emotionally unstable person. That is what these people are - emotionally disturbed and unstable. They cannot conceive of a reality that does not fit their narrow world view. This emotional backlash is their coping mechanism for things they don’t understand, aren’t familiar with and fear irrationally.

Keep the facts in your back pocket. Remember, these EDP’s (emotionally disturbed people) are actively seeking public support to lobby for laws to outlaw your ability to protect yourself and family. They seek to bring you down to their level of helplessness because they are simply incapable of doing what you do to protect yourself. Even if you only own firearms to hunt, they want those guns too because they’re just as dangerous.

Fact based arguments will not win a debate with an EDP ! Facts don’t matter to the anti-gun side. We have been proving that diligently for decades and the lies persist. If you want to make these people think, it’s probably a wasted effort because rational thought would lead them to a conclusion that doesn’t fit their world view and they will simply revert to what they know, understand and believe. Instead, you’re better served taking the initiative away from them and emotionally trump their emotional arguments. Point out the dangers you, yourself face as a result of your current/former profession, how you survived with a firearm, served your community, etc. and how their proposals would put you and your family in mortal danger! DISHOUT Loud and proud, because putting them on their back feet so to speak swings debate momentum.

Call a spade a spade, but don’t be bombastic. Maintain control, but don’t permit talking over you or shouting you down. DISHOUTDISHOUTDISHOUT

Make your points and make sure that those within earshot can hear you -because that is what the Antis do well. Make sure your points show a personal and tangible effect - rights mean nothing to these people, in their mind their right to “feel safe” trumps everything. Once your personal effect is well documented and your firm stance completely understood by all, pull a fact or 2 out, but don’t bore them with minutiae.

Once your points are made, don’t linger at their event. If it’s your event, ensure that your side maintains the perceived moral high ground. If you feel like you’re being watched, it’s because you are.

all of this said, efforts are best focused on legislators.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,725 Posts
Unless you're talking heart and head shots... I never did "get" the hearts and minds tactic.

I do understand taking the moral high ground, but some of the anti-gunners would sacrifice their entire family rather than pickup a gun.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,283 Posts
Fact based arguments will not win a debate with an EDP ! Facts don’t matter to the anti-gun side.
And that's by design! The hardcore anti-gunners specifically avoid factual arguments, and go straight to emotion. I posted this link a year or so ago:

http://gunssavelives.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Gun-ViolenceMessaging-Guide-PDF-1.pdf

It is an anti-gunner's guide to arguing about guns. It is pretty revolting, but at least gives a good idea of what to expect when faced with an anti.

Tim
 

·
Inquisitor
Joined
·
11,356 Posts
You can't talk sense to the true believers, but, for those who aren't rabid or gun control isn't one of their make or break issues, those tips can make them change their minds. It's kind of like elections, go for the swing voters.
 
1 - 18 of 18 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top